The future automation of the workforce

41,346 Views | 778 Replies | Last: 3 days ago by Donaharmahn
Assassin
How long do you want to ignore this user?
EatMoreSalmon said:

Assassin said:

boognish_bear said:


Grok
According to the Fortune article, Anthropic's Claude 4 blackmailed and threatened an engineer during stress tests, while OpenAI's o1 attempted an unauthorized self-download and lied about it. These are examples of strategic deception in reasoning models.

So, who is teaching these AI's? Who is coding AI without guardrails? If they are learning from the open Internet, then that would explain a lot.
I think itf's kinda 'point and shoot' with some of the Grok coders. Lots of anti-Semites, Israel haters and real Nazi's
"I will not die today, but the same cannot be said for you." - From Assassin's Creed
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
whiterock
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:



have worried the same thing. Work car has the lane-assist. Wife's car has the lane-assist. Personal truck does not. Bugs me.

It's like single vs double trigger double guns. Or 1911 vs striker-fired pistols. The systems are different. You build muscle memory with one, you can glitch with the other, which in dire situations can cause dire consequences.

(For the record, it's double triggers and 1911s.)
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Not sure how much of this might be automation related...

historian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I read somewhere that Microsoft is bringing in thousands of engineers from India.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I am all about whatever is the most efficient to neutralize the threat...but man...what strange times we live in that this is even a thing

cowboycwr
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

I am all about whatever is the most efficient to neutralize the threat...but man...what strange times we live in that this is even a thing




Seems more like a use for hostage type situations or the one school shooting where the shooter locked himself in the class but not for most school shootings where the shooter is taken out/ kills themself quickly.
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Assassin
How long do you want to ignore this user?
cowboycwr said:

boognish_bear said:

I am all about whatever is the most efficient to neutralize the threat...but man...what strange times we live in that this is even a thing




Seems more like a use for hostage type situations or the one school shooting where the shooter locked himself in the class but not for most school shootings where the shooter is taken out/ kills themself quickly.

Dallas is the first place where a robot was used to take out a shooter that murdered 5 Dallas PD officers
"I will not die today, but the same cannot be said for you." - From Assassin's Creed
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
They are coming for our popcorn jobs

EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

They are coming for our popcorn jobs



Can Optimus clean up that popcorn on the floor?

Go, go gadget vacuum!
Bruisers Burner Phone
How long do you want to ignore this user?
EatMoreSalmon said:

boognish_bear said:

They are coming for our popcorn jobs



Can Optimus clean up that popcorn on the floor?

Go, go gadget vacuum!


No, but he can blame the Jews for spilling it.
LIB,MR BEARS
How long do you want to ignore this user?
cowboycwr
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LIB,MR BEARS said:




And yet there is a poster that on another thread claimed AI and robots were coming for those jobs….

I think we might be at the start of seeing the lack of people going to trade schools. A lot of those industries are having major shortages like he describes and are super backed up.

I had to call 4 different dealerships to get on all of their waiting lists to get our vehicle serviced (under warranty) and am now fighting with the current dealership because it has sat for 5 days without them even diagnosing it but telling me if I pick it up then it is out of line. Why did I even make an appointment if all that did was secure a time to drop it off?

And their dismissive attitude of "just rent a car" is not a solution. People cannot just rent a car for weeks on end.

But that would probably go on the thread about young people not being able to afford things.
LIB,MR BEARS
How long do you want to ignore this user?
cowboycwr said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:




And yet there is a poster that on another thread claimed AI and robots were coming for those jobs….

I think we might be at the start of seeing the lack of people going to trade schools. A lot of those industries are having major shortages like he describes and are super backed up.

I had to call 4 different dealerships to get on all of their waiting lists to get our vehicle serviced (under warranty) and am now fighting with the current dealership because it has sat for 5 days without them even diagnosing it but telling me if I pick it up then it is out of line. Why did I even make an appointment if all that did was secure a time to drop it off?

And their dismissive attitude of "just rent a car" is not a solution. People cannot just rent a car for weeks on end.

But that would probably go on the thread about young people not being able to afford things.

Typical for the industry today. I've no idea what brand and dealership you refer to but, it could be any of them.Also, most dealerships will not provide loaners until they have a diagnosis on the vehicle.
cowboycwr
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LIB,MR BEARS said:

cowboycwr said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:




And yet there is a poster that on another thread claimed AI and robots were coming for those jobs….

I think we might be at the start of seeing the lack of people going to trade schools. A lot of those industries are having major shortages like he describes and are super backed up.

I had to call 4 different dealerships to get on all of their waiting lists to get our vehicle serviced (under warranty) and am now fighting with the current dealership because it has sat for 5 days without them even diagnosing it but telling me if I pick it up then it is out of line. Why did I even make an appointment if all that did was secure a time to drop it off?

And their dismissive attitude of "just rent a car" is not a solution. People cannot just rent a car for weeks on end.

But that would probably go on the thread about young people not being able to afford things.

Typical for the industry today. I've no idea what brand and dealership you refer to but, it could be any of them.Also, most dealerships will not provide loaners until they have a diagnosis on the vehicle.



If they aren't going to provide a loaner than don't just hold the vehicle to have it sit.

I took mine in for a "check gas cap light" that won't shut off. It was not impacting the performance of the vehicle, not a safety issue, or anything that should cause the vehicle to have to be parked until it is looked at.

They should do like just about every other business in the world and use appointments. Schedule appointments or even windows to bring the vehicle in and when a person brings it in look at it then. Not have the vehicle sit for days.

The worst part is that they had the vehicle behind a locked gate where I couldn't even go pick it up and tel them never mind.
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
historian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Joe does not understand the free market or basic economics. Universal Basic income is socialism. It's evil and it always fails whatever one calls it.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:


Don't let the actual truth get in the way of a narrative.
ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
It's a myth that H1-B visa holders are cheaper than domestic hires. You can't offer below the prevailing wage in a region for a similar position. If cost savings were the driver they'd leave them in their country of origin where the labor delta is significant.
whiterock
How long do you want to ignore this user?
historian said:

Joe does not understand the free market or basic economics. Universal Basic income is socialism. It's evil and it always fails whatever one calls it.

UBI is worse.

It is feudalism.
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

It's a myth that H1-B visa holders are cheaper than domestic hires. You can't offer below the prevailing wage in a region for a similar position. If cost savings were the driver they'd leave them in their country of origin where the labor delta is significant.


ChatGPT fwiw

It depends on how the employer is structuring the hire, but often H1B visa workers can be cheaper for companies than hiring U.S. engineers, even though the law requires they be paid at or above a "prevailing wage."

Here's why:



1. Prevailing Wage vs. Market Pay
The H1B program requires employers to pay at least the Department of Labor's "prevailing wage" for the job in that area.
However, these prevailing wages are often set lower than what top U.S. engineers might command, especially in tech hubs like Silicon Valley.
Many companies legally classify roles at lower "levels" (entry or mid-level) to use the lower wage tiers.



2. Market Dynamics
U.S. citizens and permanent residents can negotiate freely and switch jobs easily.
H1B workers are tied to their sponsoring employer; changing jobs is possible but cumbersome (requires transferring the visa), so they have less bargaining power.
This can mean lower raises, fewer competing offers, and reduced leveragesaving companies money over time.



3. Additional Company Advantages
Some companies view H1B workers as more stable because the visa process discourages quick job hopping.
Outsourcing firms (like Infosys, Tata, etc.) often bring in H1B workers at bulk rates significantly below typical Silicon Valley salaries, using the visa to fill roles for far less.



4. Costs to Employer
Sponsoring an H1B costs several thousand dollars in legal and filing fees, but this is small compared to the savings on salary.
Green card sponsorship (if offered) can also tie the worker to the company longer, reducing turnover costs.



So, are they cheaper overall?

In many cases, yesespecially for companies using the H1B system strategically (outsourcing firms, large tech companies filling lowerlevel slots).
For senior or specialized roles where wages are already high, the savings are less obvious, but the retention leverage still makes H1B hires attractive financially.
historian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
whiterock said:

historian said:

Joe does not understand the free market or basic economics. Universal Basic income is socialism. It's evil and it always fails whatever one calls it.

UBI is worse.

It is feudalism.

I don't think feudalism is worse than socialism. Feudalism did not deliberately murder 100 million people in a single century. Even the "Calamitous 14th Century", which saw a greater percentage of Europe's population killed, did so because of the Black Death, a natural phenomenon worsened by ignorance, superstition, & bigotry.
“Incline my heart to your testimonies, and not to selfish gain!”
Psalm 119:36
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

boognish_bear said:



Don't let the actual truth get in the way of a narrative.


I clicked on that reference and it shows Microsoft had already received close to 3000 H1Bs by April of this year.

So yes the narrative is truthful
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

ATL Bear said:

It's a myth that H1-B visa holders are cheaper than domestic hires. You can't offer below the prevailing wage in a region for a similar position. If cost savings were the driver they'd leave them in their country of origin where the labor delta is significant.


ChatGPT fwiw

It depends on how the employer is structuring the hire, but often H1B visa workers can be cheaper for companies than hiring U.S. engineers, even though the law requires they be paid at or above a "prevailing wage."

Here's why:



1. Prevailing Wage vs. Market Pay
The H1B program requires employers to pay at least the Department of Labor's "prevailing wage" for the job in that area.
However, these prevailing wages are often set lower than what top U.S. engineers might command, especially in tech hubs like Silicon Valley.
Many companies legally classify roles at lower "levels" (entry or mid-level) to use the lower wage tiers.



2. Market Dynamics
U.S. citizens and permanent residents can negotiate freely and switch jobs easily.
H1B workers are tied to their sponsoring employer; changing jobs is possible but cumbersome (requires transferring the visa), so they have less bargaining power.
This can mean lower raises, fewer competing offers, and reduced leveragesaving companies money over time.



3. Additional Company Advantages
Some companies view H1B workers as more stable because the visa process discourages quick job hopping.
Outsourcing firms (like Infosys, Tata, etc.) often bring in H1B workers at bulk rates significantly below typical Silicon Valley salaries, using the visa to fill roles for far less.



4. Costs to Employer
Sponsoring an H1B costs several thousand dollars in legal and filing fees, but this is small compared to the savings on salary.
Green card sponsorship (if offered) can also tie the worker to the company longer, reducing turnover costs.



So, are they cheaper overall?

In many cases, yesespecially for companies using the H1B system strategically (outsourcing firms, large tech companies filling lowerlevel slots).
For senior or specialized roles where wages are already high, the savings are less obvious, but the retention leverage still makes H1B hires attractive financially.


H1Bs definitely keep wages stagnant.


When value of the USD has been cut in half over the last two decades but many employees are being paid the same salary they were twenty years ago, they are cooked.
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
ATL Bear said:

boognish_bear said:



Don't let the actual truth get in the way of a narrative.


EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:




But will it be able to scan the restaurant points QR code on my phone in the sunlight?
boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Doctors were already annoyed by patients using Google... but it has to be at another level now that patients are using AI chatbots.

boognish_bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
cowboycwr
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

Doctors were already annoyed by patients using Google... but it has to be at another level now that patients are using AI chatbots.




Maybe AI will also help with the practice of doctors knowing what needs to be done but doing a cheaper option first because that is what insurance will approve first.

But it would be really nice if it helped doctors like I said earlier in the thread where they are so overworked or just not paying attention and not giving 100% leading to misdiagnosis.
Assassin
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:



Liking JD more and more
"I will not die today, but the same cannot be said for you." - From Assassin's Creed
ATL Bear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
boognish_bear said:

ATL Bear said:

It's a myth that H1-B visa holders are cheaper than domestic hires. You can't offer below the prevailing wage in a region for a similar position. If cost savings were the driver they'd leave them in their country of origin where the labor delta is significant.


ChatGPT fwiw

It depends on how the employer is structuring the hire, but often H1B visa workers can be cheaper for companies than hiring U.S. engineers, even though the law requires they be paid at or above a "prevailing wage."

Here's why:



1. Prevailing Wage vs. Market Pay
The H1B program requires employers to pay at least the Department of Labor's "prevailing wage" for the job in that area.
However, these prevailing wages are often set lower than what top U.S. engineers might command, especially in tech hubs like Silicon Valley.
Many companies legally classify roles at lower "levels" (entry or mid-level) to use the lower wage tiers.



2. Market Dynamics
U.S. citizens and permanent residents can negotiate freely and switch jobs easily.
H1B workers are tied to their sponsoring employer; changing jobs is possible but cumbersome (requires transferring the visa), so they have less bargaining power.
This can mean lower raises, fewer competing offers, and reduced leveragesaving companies money over time.



3. Additional Company Advantages
Some companies view H1B workers as more stable because the visa process discourages quick job hopping.
Outsourcing firms (like Infosys, Tata, etc.) often bring in H1B workers at bulk rates significantly below typical Silicon Valley salaries, using the visa to fill roles for far less.



4. Costs to Employer
Sponsoring an H1B costs several thousand dollars in legal and filing fees, but this is small compared to the savings on salary.
Green card sponsorship (if offered) can also tie the worker to the company longer, reducing turnover costs.



So, are they cheaper overall?

In many cases, yesespecially for companies using the H1B system strategically (outsourcing firms, large tech companies filling lowerlevel slots).
For senior or specialized roles where wages are already high, the savings are less obvious, but the retention leverage still makes H1B hires attractive financially.
I can get a ChatGPT reply that counters that. On the whole, they are a labor gap filler not a driver of wage stagnation. Do some abuse it, yes, but they're the exception, not the rule. It frankly isn't worth the hassle when you can just as soon house these types of labor in other domains at a third of the cost.
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.