quash said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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quash said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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If you can't do your job without violating citizen's rights then resigning is a good idea.

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I bet you don't even know any LEOs personally.

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You lose.

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In that case, you might want to talk to them, maybe even listen this time

TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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Quote:

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

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I see the Self-Righteous Left is feeling grand.

TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

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People like me? Describe.

Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

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People like me? Describe.

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He's feeling happy for BLM Inc, Maxine, and all the haters. They done got themselves a white cop in prison, all they need now is to teach law enforcement to bow down to CRT and CNN.

The quality of recruits for urban police departments this year will make Police Academy seem like high standards.

TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

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People like me? Describe.

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"If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY." Self identification. You outed yourself.

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Describe me then?

I wanted guilty of manslaughter, not murder.

TexasScientist said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

---

People like me? Describe.

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He's feeling happy for BLM Inc, Maxine, and all the haters. They done got themselves a white cop in prison, all they need now is to teach law enforcement to bow down to CRT and CNN.

The quality of recruits for urban police departments this year will make Police Academy seem like high standards.

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I can't imagine a more racist remark to make in the wake of this verdict. I didn't think you were of such, but I can't say I am surprised though.

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BS on your smear attempt. It's hardly racist to realize that this effort to purge police, no matter what the prosecutor sold the jury, is going to chill any desire to work in urban departments.

Black cops as well as white cops are going to abandon places like Minneapolis or Chicago and find jobs where they are not targeted by the politicians as well as the criminals.

If you think this verdict won't chase off good cops and leave only the bad ones, you are going to be really surprised by the next few years.

Forest Bueller_bf said:

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Well I'm certainly not a "leftist" but feel like justice was served in this case.

The day I saw it happen I saw a murder, and it still looks like a murder.

Not premeditated murder, but negligence and a total lack of regard for another persons life.

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It was a clear case of manslaughter. Murder 2 was for the political points and to assauge the media.

Oldbear83 said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

---

People like me? Describe.

---

He's feeling happy for BLM Inc, Maxine, and all the haters. They done got themselves a white cop in prison, all they need now is to teach law enforcement to bow down to CRT and CNN.

The quality of recruits for urban police departments this year will make Police Academy seem like high standards.

---

I can't imagine a more racist remark to make in the wake of this verdict. I didn't think you were of such, but I can't say I am surprised though.

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BS on your smear attempt. It's hardly racist to realize that this effort to purge police, no matter what the prosecutor sold the jury, is going to chill any desire to work in urban departments.

Black cops as well as white cops are going to abandon places like Minneapolis or Chicago and find jobs where they are not targeted by the politicians as well as the criminals.

If you think this verdict won't chase off good cops and leave only the bad ones, you are going to be really surprised by the next few years.

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You have ignored the murder 3 count, which does not require intent of anything. The evidence clearly fit that count also.

So you seem to be saying that the world is going to end because prosecutors charged and the jury found murder 2.

The Minn. murder 2 statue requires that the death be caused in the commission of another felony. The theory here is that the felony was aggravated assault. Saw a former federal prosecutor say that whether A police officer acting in line of duty could be inflicting an "assault" that bumps the death to murder 2 is an open question under Minn. law.

Given all that, why do you see this prosecution as some sort of witch hunt? What would have been an appropriate result today in your view?

Booray said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

---

People like me? Describe.

---

He's feeling happy for BLM Inc, Maxine, and all the haters. They done got themselves a white cop in prison, all they need now is to teach law enforcement to bow down to CRT and CNN.

The quality of recruits for urban police departments this year will make Police Academy seem like high standards.

---

I can't imagine a more racist remark to make in the wake of this verdict. I didn't think you were of such, but I can't say I am surprised though.

---

BS on your smear attempt. It's hardly racist to realize that this effort to purge police, no matter what the prosecutor sold the jury, is going to chill any desire to work in urban departments.

Black cops as well as white cops are going to abandon places like Minneapolis or Chicago and find jobs where they are not targeted by the politicians as well as the criminals.

If you think this verdict won't chase off good cops and leave only the bad ones, you are going to be really surprised by the next few years.

---

You have ignored the murder 3 count, which does not require intent of anything. The evidence clearly fit that count also.

So you seem to be saying that the world is going to end because prosecutors charged and the jury found murder 2.

The Minn. murder 2 statue requires that the death be caused in the commission of another felony. The theory here is that the felony was aggravated assault. Saw a former federal prosecutor say that whether A police officer acting in line of duty could be inflicting an "assault" that bumps the death to murder 2 is an open question under Minn. law.

Given all that, why do you see this prosecution as some sort of witch hunt? What would have been an appropriate result today in your view?

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Chauvin was willing to plead to murder 3 last year, but the prosecutor wanted - and got - his show trial.

I see Manslaughter as the best choice, because it sends a message to the police that bad cops go to prison, but all facts are considered, Floyd's criminal history and drug use were directly significant but swept under the rug because those facts were inconvenient.

The jury should have been sequestered from the start and the trial nowhere near Minneapolis. The judge clearly did not mind letting the jury be exposed to the mob mentality. The jury got the message that anything but the maximum would lead to riots. That's dirty and then some, and I don't just mean Chauvin.

One bad cop is going to prison. Good. But a lot of bad people profited from some very dishonest and manipulative behavior, and too bad if it reinforces lies that will encourage young Black men to confront police when stopped rather than comply and avoid becoming the next George Floyd.

I doubt Chauvin survives prison.

Booray said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Booray said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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TexasScientist said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

---

As you should. With people like you and Chauvin gone, police departments around the country will be for the better. Murder with impunity is not acceptable in a free country.

---

People like me? Describe.

---

He's feeling happy for BLM Inc, Maxine, and all the haters. They done got themselves a white cop in prison, all they need now is to teach law enforcement to bow down to CRT and CNN.

The quality of recruits for urban police departments this year will make Police Academy seem like high standards.

---

I can't imagine a more racist remark to make in the wake of this verdict. I didn't think you were of such, but I can't say I am surprised though.

---

BS on your smear attempt. It's hardly racist to realize that this effort to purge police, no matter what the prosecutor sold the jury, is going to chill any desire to work in urban departments.

Black cops as well as white cops are going to abandon places like Minneapolis or Chicago and find jobs where they are not targeted by the politicians as well as the criminals.

If you think this verdict won't chase off good cops and leave only the bad ones, you are going to be really surprised by the next few years.

---

You have ignored the murder 3 count, which does not require intent of anything. The evidence clearly fit that count also.

So you seem to be saying that the world is going to end because prosecutors charged and the jury found murder 2.

The Minn. murder 2 statue requires that the death be caused in the commission of another felony. The theory here is that the felony was aggravated assault. Saw a former federal prosecutor say that whether A police officer acting in line of duty could be inflicting an "assault" that bumps the death to murder 2 is an open question under Minn. law.

Given all that, why do you see this prosecution as some sort of witch hunt? What would have been an appropriate result today in your view?

---

Chauvin was willing to plead to murder 3 last year, but the prosecutor wanted - and got - his show trial.

I see Manslaughter as the best choice, because it sends a message to the police that bad cops go to prison, but all facts are considered, Floyd's criminal history and drug use were directly significant but swept under the rug because those facts were inconvenient.

The jury should have been sequestered from the start and the trial nowhere near Minneapolis. The judge clearly did not mind letting the jury be exposed to the mob mentality. The jury got the message that anything but the maximum would lead to riots. That's dirty and then some, and I don't just mean Chauvin.

One bad cop is going to prison. Good. But a lot of bad people profited from some very dishonest and manipulative behavior, and too bad if it reinforces lies that will encourage young Black men to confront police when stopped rather than comply and avoid becoming the next George Floyd.

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https://apnews.com/article/derek-chauvin-george-floyd-third-degree-2deefbc803665f808676fbbb8a131390

The reporting is that William Barr, not Keith Ellison, nixed the potential plea deal.

Again, you seem unusually upset that the state successfully prosecuted him on a charge that carries up to a 40-year sentence rather than on a 25-year sentence. They send the same message.

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You keep ignoring what I actually said. The problem is not Chauvin, it's the message sent about cops, young Black males, the media's duty to avoid pouring gasoline on fires, and the politicians' never-ending desire to profit from these tragedies.

Doc Holliday said:

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I doubt Chauvin survives prison.

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The only thing inmates hate more than cops is child molesters. I have no problem with Chauvin going into the general population of prison. Charles Darwin. Survival of the fittest.

quash said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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quash said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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quash said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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quash said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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If I was a police officer, I would resign TODAY.

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If you can't do your job without violating citizen's rights then resigning is a good idea.

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I bet you don't even know any LEOs personally.

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You lose.

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In that case, you might want to talk to them, maybe even listen this time

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I have, you lose again.

We had good talks after the Rodney King case, and haven't stopped. They mostly think following the law is a good thing.

I did do a ride along with one cop who was opposed to the coming vehicle cams in Dallas because sometimes you have to do more than the law allows. That's the kind of guy his fellow officers wouldn't miss.

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I am not saying Chauvin was a good cop. He was not. But this trial was an attack on cops, especially Minnesota cops, and will drive a lot of good cops to move to places where they are not defunded, harassed, and vilified by the media.

My LEO friends tell me they left Houston PD because of just this kind of crap. They joined other departments, often in smaller towns, because the mayor here, the District Attorney and the news services were on a mission to paint them as bad no matter what they did. And when they found one bad cop, the media used that to attack all cops.

I guess you never talked to any law enforcement friends like that.

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You're on a roll of wrongness.

My friends at DPD, specifically, left over things like pay and job requirements that didn't make the community safer. One of the things I learned from my LEO friends was that citizen safety was the highest priority. One of the motorjocks consistently wrote citations for No Seat Belt, and routinely caught **** from citizens. He would shrug it off because on two different occasions he had to pull bodies out of windshields and never wanted a third occasion.

How about we discuss the issues and you quit guessing wrongly about my life, which is irrelevant to the discussion.

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You continue to lie about what I said. The only part about you was the last paragraph, which you essentially confirmed.

You are very dishonest on this subject, quash.

Now as to issues.

Pull your head out and read this time: How people respect and cooperate with the Police is the issue, not Chauvin or your friends at DPD who never worry about the cops murdered by that BLM supporter a few years back, or whether the mayor will throw them under the bus the next time there is a media story about all cops being bad.

It's about frank discussion about keeping young men alive when they encounter police, by avoiding confrontation and by police building rapport with communities, which most cops do anyway.

Oldbear83 said:

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Now as to issues.

Pull your head out and read this time: How people respect and cooperate with the Police is the issue, not Chauvin or your friends at DPD who never worry about the cops murdered by that BLM supporter a few years back, or whether the mayor will throw them under the bus the next time there is a media story about all cops being bad.

It's about frank discussion about keeping young men alive when they encounter police, by avoiding confrontation and by police building rapport with communities, which most cops do anyway.

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Yeah, I've addressed that already:
"No verdict can restore a life but this is as close as we get to justice when somebody dies: accountability. Whether that brings peace to the Floyd family? I don't know.

Officers who act like Chauvin just make the world harder for everybody, but especially for other cops. The good ones have to deal with the damage to the relationship between officers and the citizens they try to serve.

The Libertarian Party is working to end qualified immunity so that officers may hesitate before they deny someone their rights.

The LP also want to reduce the number of times an officer has to deal with a citizen by reducing the number of police interactions that do not involve violence: abolish victimless crimes like drug possession, consensual sex between adults, braiding hair without a state license, selling cigarettes individually, working without "your papers", etc.

There are concrete things we can do to make the world both safer and more free."

You keep dwelling on Chauvin, and I agree he was a bad cop. But you seem silent about Waters' call for violence, about CNN's unending screed about police violence when a young Black man is eighteen times more likely to be killed by another black man than by police.

And while I am sorry for Floyd's death, he is neither a martyr nor an ideal to follow.

Canon said:

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Forest Bueller_bf said:

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Verdict is in.

Bet he is guilty on all counts.

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Of course. The jury don't want their lives destroyed and they'd likely not want their city to burn. Violent mobs have power.

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Maybe. But he was clearly guilty of manslaughter and murder 3 seemed to fit. The issue on murder 2 is more legal than factual.

The verdict fit the evidence.

Doc Holliday said:

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I doubt Chauvin survives prison.

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There are thousands of small business owners who hope you are right .

bear2be2 said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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bear2be2 just ignores any facts that get in the way of his rant.

The dominant fact in this thread, b2b2, is that the evidence destroys your claims, all of them.

I get that you are afraid of guns. No one is making you own one, but no, you don't get to ignore the rights of those who want and need their second amendment rights, and two farking bad if you don't like it.

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I'm not ignoring your rights or anyone else's. I have yet to say a single word about your second amendment rights in this thread. I've only said -- quite accurately -- that gun ownership based on self-defense use is based on irrational fear. And that the gun lobby has deftly used that fear to create a society with a terribly unhealthy relationship with firearms.

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Help us understand what you mean by "a society with a terribly unhealthy relationship with firearms". Does that apply to everyone who owns guns? Maybe just some gun owners in certain urban areas? Is there a difference in your thoughts between people similar to me who have advanced degrees, own scary black rifles, and who have grand kids, over against drug dealers and gang bangers with they (sic) 9s and "clips"?