Limited IQ Redneck in PU said:

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Which one of these three carry a death sentence?

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Lots and lots of fentanyl and methamphetamine and thrown in for good measure a little cannabinoids.

Looks like Chauvin may just be get off altogether. Apparently the witnesses called today by the prosectuion actually said Chauvin didn't use excessive force or a deadly hold on Floyd. Things not looking good for the prosecution.

muddybrazos said:

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I think once the defense shows the video from other angles they won't be able to convict for murder. Other photo angles show Chauvin's knee on Floyds shoulder plus the fact he had 3x lethal dose of fentanyl in his system.

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He's probably going to walk.

- coroner report = 3x overdose of Fentanyl.
- video showing white substance in his mouth
- video showing him saying he couldn't breathe over and over from the time he was handcuffed
- video shows tactics which are widely taught in police academies
- video shows officers taking care, making observations (which support the overdose scenario)
- no evidence in video or coroner report that Chauvin's knee restricted the airway.

Best objective case is that Chauvin and the two others are guilty of brutality for keeping a handcuffed man in a restraint hold. But the politics are all over this one. Anything could happen, to include jurors deciding to convict of murder solely to avoid civil unrest.

J.B.Katz said:

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Does anybody think Floyd would be alive today if Chauvin hadn't kept the knee to his neck until he lost consciousness and then kept it there?

2 autopsy reports said the neck compression caused his death.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/30/facebook-posts/no-autopsy-doesnt-say-george-floyd-died-overdose/

• Two autopsy reports said the manner of George Floyd's death was a homicide. Neither said the cause of his death was a fentanyl overdose.
• The Hennepin County medical examiner found fentanyl in Floyd's system, but the autopsy said the cause of his death was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law-enforcement subdual restraint, and neck compression."
• Experts told the Washington Post they did not believe Floyd died from the fentanyl.

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Those assessment were done before the toxicology results were in. They showed Floyd had 3x lethal levels of fentanyl, plus other intoxicants. Depressed respiration is one dynamic of fentanyl overdose. And that all ties with the videos, showing Floyd was saying he could breathe while he was standing erect.

Also pertinent, but pointedly not reported in deep state media:

https://davidharrisjr.com/steven/use-of-force-expert-state-witness-throws-wrench-in-prosecutions-knee-on-neck-narrative/

BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

J.B.Katz said:

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Does anybody think Floyd would be alive today if Chauvin hadn't kept the knee to his neck until he lost consciousness and then kept it there?

2 autopsy reports said the neck compression caused his death.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/30/facebook-posts/no-autopsy-doesnt-say-george-floyd-died-overdose/

• Two autopsy reports said the manner of George Floyd's death was a homicide. Neither said the cause of his death was a fentanyl overdose.
• The Hennepin County medical examiner found fentanyl in Floyd's system, but the autopsy said the cause of his death was "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law-enforcement subdual restraint, and neck compression."
• Experts told the Washington Post they did not believe Floyd died from the fentanyl.

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Pretty sure he'd be alive if he wasn't a drug addicted criminal hyped on fentanyl

whiterock said:

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muddybrazos said:

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I think once the defense shows the video from other angles they won't be able to convict for murder. Other photo angles show Chauvin's knee on Floyds shoulder plus the fact he had 3x lethal dose of fentanyl in his system.

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He's probably going to walk.

- coroner report = 3x overdose of Fentanyl.
- video showing white substance in his mouth
- video showing him saying he couldn't breathe over and over from the time he was handcuffed
- video shows tactics which are widely taught in police academies
- video shows officers taking care, making observations (which support the overdose scenario)
- no evidence in video or coroner report that Chauvin's knee restricted the airway.

Best objective case is that Chauvin and the two others are guilty of brutality for keeping a handcuffed man in a restraint hold. But the politics are all over this one. Anything could happen, to include jurors deciding to convict of murder solely to avoid civil unrest.

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No chance the ex cop walks .

Everyone from the judge down to the dumbest member of the jury knows without a doubt that if the ex cop walks .......riots will explode in cities throughout the country .

Dozens or even hundreds will be killed .

Guilty or not the ex cop is going to be sacrificed' for the greater good '.

BellCountyBear said:

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BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

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A use of force can start off being reasonable and justified, and still end up as a civil or criminal violation.

BellCountyBear said:

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BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

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You obviously didn't watch the 8 minute death sentence if you think that was a knee to the shoulder.

Buddha Bear said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

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You obviously didn't watch the 8 minute death sentence if you think that was a knee to the shoulder.

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That, right there, is a brilliant example of a lack of objectivity. If you ingest massive quantities of poison (which he did) and die doing something else, it's absurd to call that other thing a death sentence. This is not a cut and dry situation. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something.

Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

Canon said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

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You obviously didn't watch the 8 minute death sentence if you think that was a knee to the shoulder.

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That, right there, is a brilliant example of a lack of objectivity. If you ingest massive quantities of poison (which he did) and die doing something else, it's absurd to call that other thing a death sentence. This is not a cut and dry situation. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something.

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It's hard to be objective when one drinks too much of the Woke Koolaid.

ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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There is more than enough reasonable doubt to believe man 1 would be the proper conviction .

But these are far from normal times.

Though the same realities exist as when OJ walked .

Got to appease the mob.

Let the BLM mob riot and destroy if they don't get the conviction they demand.

And let law enforcement kick their asS if they try to burn cities, and let citizens shoot to defend themselves and their property.

If the Jan. 6 "insurrectionists" are terrorists for using violence to thwart a fair, democratic electoral process, then what would you liberals/leftists call using or threatening violence to thwart fair judicial due process? Likewise "enemies of the state"? Then, the BLM perpetrators should receive no different treatment should they choose that path. Shot like Ashli Babbit, hunted on social media and arrested, and losing their jobs and business - the whole gamut.

ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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More prisons and police are the last thing we need.

It's hilarious how all the things we supposedly stand for as a country are not true:

1) the UNITED States. Reality: split right down the middle with daily news programming dedicated to ripping it apart.

2) Statue of Liberty: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Reality: No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

3) Land of the free! Reality: more people in prison per capita than every country in the world.

Buddha Bear said:

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ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

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MILLIONS have gotten 'in' without the requirements you mention .

Spend a couple of weeks checking out the border between Eagle Pass, Texas and Columbus, New Mexico .

Might learn something with your own eyes.

Buddha Bear said:

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ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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More prisons and police are the last thing we need.

It's hilarious how all the things we supposedly stand for as a country are not true:

1) the UNITED States. Reality: split right down the middle with daily news programming dedicated to ripping it apart.

2) Statue of Liberty: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Reality: No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

3) Land of the free! Reality: more people in prison per capita than every country in the world.

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More police are necessary in areas where crime is high. History proves increased police presence works. (See New York for evidence of same.)

The US is split, to be sure. But it's a federalist system. The thing which the term UNITED modifies is STATES. If the federal government would step back and let states decide for themselves how they wish to function, rather than encroaching on state control, our split would be less of an issue. It's exacerbated by people wishing to use federal power to force everyone in every state to follow their view of government and that is not how our nation was designed to work.

The statue of liberty is not a founding document and certainly isn't law. Referencing it is usually just a weak rhetorical technique applied by unscrupulous politicians. (See Schumer on same)

Freedom in America is predicated on not harming others, first and foremost. The negative liberty nature of the bill of rights indicates that government is to be restricted from interfering with your life in a much larger measure than most countries and should do so unless or until you break a law. I've never gone to prison. I suspect you have never gone to prison. I don't think you had to work overly hard to not go to prison. Because there are large numbers of people who have gone to prison doesn't make prisons bad for society and doesn't mean we aren't a free country. You are never free to simply be a criminal. The disparate impact argument used in almost every context is a foolish argument.

Buddha Bear said:

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Canon said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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More prisons and police are the last thing we need.

It's hilarious how all the things we supposedly stand for as a country are not true:

1) the UNITED States. Reality: split right down the middle with daily news programming dedicated to ripping it apart.

2) Statue of Liberty: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Reality: No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

3) Land of the free! Reality: more people in prison per capita than every country in the world.

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More police are necessary in areas where crime is high. History proves increased police presence works. (See New York for evidence of same.)

The statue of liberty is not a founding document and certainly isn't law. Referencing it is usually just a weak rhetorical technique applied by unscrupulous politicians. (See Schumer on same)

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Then take that mofo down. It's not what we stand for at present. It's shameful.

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It was a gift whose image and associated poem have been misused by unscrupulous politicians. If you'd like to tear down yet another statue, I'm sure you can find support.

Buddha Bear said:

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Canon said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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Canon said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

---

More prisons and police are the last thing we need.

It's hilarious how all the things we supposedly stand for as a country are not true:

1) the UNITED States. Reality: split right down the middle with daily news programming dedicated to ripping it apart.

2) Statue of Liberty: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." Reality: No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

3) Land of the free! Reality: more people in prison per capita than every country in the world.

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More police are necessary in areas where crime is high. History proves increased police presence works. (See New York for evidence of same.)

The statue of liberty is not a founding document and certainly isn't law. Referencing it is usually just a weak rhetorical technique applied by unscrupulous politicians. (See Schumer on same)

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Then take that mofo down. It's not what we stand for at present. It's shameful.

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It was a gift whose image and associated poem have been misused by unscrupulous politicians. If you'd like to tear down yet another statue, I'm sure you can find support.

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Glad you agree we don't need it.

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I didn't say that or imply it. The totality of what I've said here does not suggest that. Do be honest.

That said, separately, I will agree with you now, no we don't need it. We don't need Mt Rushmore or any other monument either. We don't have monuments because we need them. We have monuments because they are waypoints of our historical journey.

The point in our history where we needed tired, poor masses ended when we became a welfare state. The moment we began paying the poor from taxes was the moment we no longer needed any additional poor.

Thee University said:

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BUMBA1 said:

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George Floyd would absolutely still be here today if he did not have a knee on his neck for 9 minutes. If I was a juror, the defense would have to prove to me beyond a doubt that Floyd would have died in that scenario without a knee to his neck. That's going to be hard to do. Chauvin knew exactly what he was doing.

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George Floyd might (can't say absolutely due to his long history of flirting with disaster, drug use, prison, violence, running with a bad crowd,etc.) still be here today if:

1. he did not do drugs - lots of lots of lots of drugs
2. he did not try to pass a counterfeit bill
3. he obeyed the police

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Former staff taking screenshots from this thread and posting it on Twitter:

laughngrin said:

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Thee University said:

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BUMBA1 said:

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George Floyd would absolutely still be here today if he did not have a knee on his neck for 9 minutes. If I was a juror, the defense would have to prove to me beyond a doubt that Floyd would have died in that scenario without a knee to his neck. That's going to be hard to do. Chauvin knew exactly what he was doing.

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George Floyd might (can't say absolutely due to his long history of flirting with disaster, drug use, prison, violence, running with a bad crowd,etc.) still be here today if:

1. he did not do drugs - lots of lots of lots of drugs
2. he did not try to pass a counterfeit bill
3. he obeyed the police

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And therefore guilty of murder? No. We can all agree that Chauvin was brutal and should be punished for police brutality. But to suggest Floyd didn't contribute mightily to his own death is simply willful ignorance or worse.

Death is not a standard, typical or likely consequence for the approved police tactic Chauvin used....unless one's body is filled with massive quantities of illegal poison. If you don't care about that, you are the problem.

BearN said:

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Former staff taking screenshots from this thread and posting it on Twitter:

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She thinks Baylor is a Christian university. That's her first mistake. It hasn't fit that bill since Livingstone took over. No Christian university would encourage a prayer delivered at graduation that attacked "straight white men" or invite an anti-Christian speaker to chapel to offer a prayer to "Mother Mystery." No Christian university would directly accuse white students of racism by recommending "students evaluate their own racism using, among other things, "Tema Okun's characteristics of white supremacy culture."" No Christian university would lay "the process of acknowledging our historical connections to slavery" at the feet of teenagers who have no reason to assume that guilt.

Actions like these are taken by people who want to wear the skin of the university they killed to keep up a pretense, allowing them to claim a morality they don't really believe in. Baylor hasn't been Christian for quite some time.

Canon said:

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BearN said:

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Former staff taking screenshots from this thread and posting it on Twitter:

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She thinks Baylor is a Christian university. That's her first mistake. It hasn't fit that bill since Livingstone took over. No Christian university would encourage a prayer delivered at graduation that attacked "straight white men" or invite an anti-Christian speaker to chapel to offer a prayer to "Mother Mystery." No Christian university would directly accuse white students of racism by recommending "students evaluate their own racism using, among other things, "Tema Okun's characteristics of white supremacy culture."" No Christian university would lay "the process of acknowledging our historical connections to slavery" at the feet of teenagers who have no reason to assume that guilt.

Actions like these are taken by people who want to wear the skin of the university they killed to keep up a pretense, allowing them to claim a morality they don't really believe in. Baylor hasn't been Christian for quite some time.

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That isn't even close to what she is trying to do with this tweet. She is trying to embarrass conservatives on this website, take conservative viewpoints from this website out of context, and twist them to suit her own liberal agenda.

BearN said:

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Canon said:

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BearN said:

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Former staff taking screenshots from this thread and posting it on Twitter:

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She thinks Baylor is a Christian university. That's her first mistake. It hasn't fit that bill since Livingstone took over. No Christian university would encourage a prayer delivered at graduation that attacked "straight white men" or invite an anti-Christian speaker to chapel to offer a prayer to "Mother Mystery." No Christian university would directly accuse white students of racism by recommending "students evaluate their own racism using, among other things, "Tema Okun's characteristics of white supremacy culture."" No Christian university would lay "the process of acknowledging our historical connections to slavery" at the feet of teenagers who have no reason to assume that guilt.

Actions like these are taken by people who want to wear the skin of the university they killed to keep up a pretense, allowing them to claim a morality they don't really believe in. Baylor hasn't been Christian for quite some time.

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That isn't at all what she is saying

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Presumably she is saying Baylor is Christian, she just seems to also believe that acting like a Christian, expecting everyone to follow laws and not supporting anti-Christian behavior, is somehow UnChristian. Either way, she's incorrect.

Okay!

Thee University said:

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BUMBA1 said:

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George Floyd would absolutely still be here today if he did not have a knee on his neck for 9 minutes. If I was a juror, the defense would have to prove to me beyond a doubt that Floyd would have died in that scenario without a knee to his neck. That's going to be hard to do. Chauvin knew exactly what he was doing.

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George Floyd might (can't say absolutely due to his long history of flirting with disaster, drug use, prison, violence, running with a bad crowd,etc.) still be here today if:

1. he did not do drugs - lots of lots of lots of drugs
2. he did not try to pass a counterfeit bill
3. he obeyed the police

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This begs the point.

The question isn't: Were there factors in Floyd's life and health that contributed to his death?

The question is: Were Chauvin's actions appropriate? If they weren't, did they contribute to his death?

Officers have testified that the answer to the first question is "No."

Medical examiners have testified that the answer to the second question is "Yes."

You seem to be arguing that if you're on drugs and have a bad heart and I shoot you in the head and you die, then you're responsible for your death.

At last, jurors will have to decide whether Chauvin's actions were responsible (they weren't) and if they caused Floyd's death (they did).

Buddha Bear said:

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Canada2017 said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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ABC BEAR said:

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Man. 1 and that's probably a stretch. He was overcharged as an appeasement to the mob, same as the cop in Atlanta in the Wendy's drive thru incident.

More funding for police and more funding for prison expansion will be a winning campaign plank in 2024.

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No one can get in without making at least 250% above the poverty line. That is the law of the land.

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MILLIONS have gotten 'in' without the requirements you mention .

Spend a couple of weeks checking out the border between Eagle Pass, Texas and Columbus, New Mexico .

Might learn something with your own eyes.

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You know what I mean.

I get that there is a major illegal immigration problem. We need secure borders. We should end birthright citizenship. But we need sensible legal immigration. We currently don't have it.

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Of course we already have 'sensible ' legal immigration.

Close to one million people a year....legally .

Leads the entire world .

Canon said:

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Buddha Bear said:

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BellCountyBear said:

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BylrFan said:

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there's no need to be on a guy for 8 minutes when there's no resisting taking place, there's 4 other cops there. Throw him in a vehicle and this wouldn't be a story.

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You obviously haven't seen the body-cam footage from the 8 minutes prior to the knee on the shoulder.

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You obviously didn't watch the 8 minute death sentence if you think that was a knee to the shoulder.

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That, right there, is a brilliant example of a lack of objectivity. If you ingest massive quantities of poison (which he did) and die doing something else, it's absurd to call that other thing a death sentence. This is not a cut and dry situation. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something.

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You too are obscuring the main points.

The main point are whether Chauvin acted appropriately and if he didn't if his actions contributed to Floyd's death.

The testimony of other officers so far has been that his actions were inappropriate. First, his knee should have been on back, not his neck. Second, he should have taken the knee off once Floyd was cuffed and subdued.

The testimony of medical experts is that while other factors were present with Floyd that contributed to his death, he would have survived that incident were it not for Chauvin's inappropriate actions.

I don't think Chauvin intentionally killed Floyd. But first I think he was pissed and frustrated and wanted to make a point to Floyd, and second I don't think he would have treated a white man that way.

Amy Pagitt said:

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Okay!

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Boy you sure showed him and explained yourself with that response. I take it he was right?