Gameday Thread: Baylor Returns to Waco to Face Kansas State

A really big part of this malaise stems from the lack of a team identity to rally around.

As fans under Briles we had a clear identity. We were going to make every defense look lost and the games were going to be exciting and fast paced. Under Rhule we saw a well coached defense that was disciplined and overachieved. It was slightly less exciting, but still a pretty clear identity to support.

This team is hard to watch because their brand is still a mystery after 6 years? Part of that is all the turnover at coordinator positions, part of that is the culture set by the HC is not one that translates well to most of us. It's hard to get excited about philosophical and esoteric ramblings.

Combine the lack of a team identity with 11am games against the 2-3 wheat Aggies in 95 degree, direct sunlight, with an administration that seems more concerned with upholding a set of antiquated and hypocritical values, and a lack of reasons other than the game to endure a 2 hour drive on I-35, and the lack of attendance is understandable.

BaylorHistory said:

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historian said:

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We Baylor fans were spoiled by Briles. We got used to lots of wins, often in a stunning fashion. The problem is that our BoR fired Briles and we have not had a span anything like that since. 2019 & 2021 were great years but outliers under different coaches.

We fans want to get back to the habit of winning: 8-10 every year, bowl game every year, winning bowl games more often than not, outstanding athletes getting national accolades & drafted, being ranked most of the time, etc. Most of all, we want exciting games that are fun to watch.

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I feel there's more to it than a coach that last coached here when the current Baylor Line were 8 years old.

By all accounts we should be at least somewhat excited about BU football. 8-1 in our last 9 conference games and BU won every single game against our rivals (Tech, TCU, UH, and SMU) on the schedule within the last calendar year.

Yet here we are with really bad attendance and attitude as a fanbase in general. This place feels more morose than we did the Morriss years and it's starting to get a bit Steele-y.

Are we bad enough fans where we need a head coach that rides a motorcycle onto the field to get excited? Did we rely on the energy that playing big names like OU, A&M, UT, and NU brought to the conference in order to feel like we were big time football boys? Is it just the negative feeling that our culture has at large right now?

I know personally I'm part of that bad fan mindset. I've moved beyond where attending BU football games was a must every single week and turned into a "well if there isn't anything else going on" type mindset. Personally that has nothing to so with the style of football as I can't think anything more entertaining than close games with the leading passer in CFB, but rather just a feeling of enjoying other aspects of life more than CFB on Saturdays.

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The competition for entertainment spending is greater than ever.
Each year a greater percentage of potential fans grew up in front of a keyboard and not engaged in real life.
The product is substandard. Mediocre results. Low energy delivery. Ugly style.
Bad game day atmosphere.
Leadership that is less Texas than any other school in Texas.
Zero ambition. Anti-pioneer. Sleeping in while others get up early.
Still insanely driven by a need to be superficially Anti-Briles to the point of bad choices.

Going to Baylor home games is like continually watching the Titanic, a feeling of impending doom. There is a lack of trust in the coaching staff to place the team in the best position to succeed. We see slow starts and same mistakes each week. Our only identity is inconsistency. Combined with the most fickle and perhaps soft in the country, this is not a good recipe. However, if we continually play 11am games in September and early October, get some misters installed from the roof!

The sad part is this is a blight to the players who one or more will be playing on Sundays which deserve support. We had some amazing plays in the 4th quarter yesterday that some fans apparently caught from Buc-ee's. My family stayed and was rewarded,

jsstewar said:

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The sad part is this is a blight to the players who one or more will be playing on Sundays which deserve support. We had some amazing plays in the 4th quarter yesterday that some fans apparently caught from Buc-ee's. My family stayed and was rewarded,

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I did feel bad for the players towards the end. There was plenty to be critical about in that game, but they never quit fighting and pulled off a pretty impressive comeback. Kind of sucked that it happened in a stadium full tumbleweeds.

We won!

In the end, that's all that counts.

boognish_bear said:

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jsstewar said:

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The sad part is this is a blight to the players who one or more will be playing on Sundays which deserve support. We had some amazing plays in the 4th quarter yesterday that some fans apparently caught from Buc-ee's. My family stayed and was rewarded,

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I did feel bad for the players towards the end. There was plenty to be critical about in that game, but they never quit fighting and pulled off a pretty impressive comeback. Kind of sucked that it happened in a stadium full tumbleweeds.

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Waco early season, is a brutal site.

But I do agree with you about this team. They are learning how to win together. Yesterday, was bigger than most think. Coming back, hanging on and getting the win will help this group gel.

I think, outside the Blue Bloods, you will see more of this with the transfer portal and NIL. Too many moving parts, less hitting in practice, turns into inconsistent product. Teams that survive the early season and come together, will be the playoff teams. I hope that is what the Aranda's team's identity is developing in to.

Quinton said:

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BaylorHistory said:

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historian said:

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We Baylor fans were spoiled by Briles. We got used to lots of wins, often in a stunning fashion. The problem is that our BoR fired Briles and we have not had a span anything like that since. 2019 & 2021 were great years but outliers under different coaches.

We fans want to get back to the habit of winning: 8-10 every year, bowl game every year, winning bowl games more often than not, outstanding athletes getting national accolades & drafted, being ranked most of the time, etc. Most of all, we want exciting games that are fun to watch.

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I feel there's more to it than a coach that last coached here when the current Baylor Line were 8 years old.

Yet here we are with really bad attendance and attitude as a fanbase in general. This place feels more morose than we did the Morriss years and it's starting to get a bit Steele-y.

Did we rely on the energy that playing big names like OU, A&M, UT, and NU brought to the conference in order to feel like we were big time football boys? Is it just the negative feeling that our culture has at large right now?

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It's a malaise. The fanbase doesn't trust the leadership or the coach. The coach has zero energy and the team is listless for huge portions of the game.. every game.. for years. The admin is really poor with details and presentation too. Perfect storm.

Compound this with,no disrespect, but nobody gets up for UH or Ucf and here it is.

The first part (no energy, weak coaching) has a much greater impact as we've all seen huge crowds for K state or a Ok st many times before. They will come.

The trust is completely gone. Will take a full season of high energy, effort, and execution to get it back. Right now even when they win they look terrible doing so and play low quality football.

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Yeah I think you hit on every point along with AP's point on entertainment competitiveness.

Its just fascinating to see us sitting at 8-1 in our last 9 conference games which is a top 5 number in school history along with the longest P4 road winning streak in school history (as far as I can tell) and being like "meh, whatever". To be fair though, I dont any of us are sitting here saying if those numbers continued we'd be saying "meh", but rather everyone expects our luck to run out starting next game after every game.

jsstewar said:

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Going to Baylor home games is like continually watching the Titanic, a feeling of impending doom. There is a lack of trust in the coaching staff to place the team in the best position to succeed. We see slow starts and same mistakes each week. Our only identity is inconsistency. Combined with the most fickle and perhaps soft in the country, this is not a good recipe. However, if we continually play 11am games in September and early October, get some misters installed from the roof!

The sad part is this is a blight to the players who one or more will be playing on Sundays which deserve support. We had some amazing plays in the 4th quarter yesterday that some fans apparently caught from Buc-ee's. My family stayed and was rewarded,

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We have a very clear identity this year, maybe the most in years. We're going to throw it around a ton, gamble on 4th down, and have a bad defense.

Sawyer has a >200 yard lead on passing yards in the entire country with the most attempts in the country. That'll change after the bye week, but it is a very clear identity.

Keepin' it Rolling.#SicEm pic.twitter.com/4yx6cxUoZ4

— Baylor Football (@BUFootball) October 4, 2025

Nice way to massage the numbers. This athletic department is funny.

Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

But tbf, if they beat Tcu on the road that would start to change things

Quinton said:

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Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

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The B12 isn't what it used to be...but there have been a couple of wins over decent teams in this run.

2024
TCU finished 9-4
TT finished 8-5
WVU (at least was a bowl team)

Not murderers row...but not all cellar dwellers

boognish_bear said:

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Quinton said:

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Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

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The B12 isn't what it used to be...but there have been a couple of wins over decent teams in this run.

2024
TCU finished 9-4
TT finished 8-5
WVU (at least was a bowl team)

Not murderers row...but not all cellar dwellers

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There is really no need to defend having won over 60% of our last 19 games.

Quinton said:

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Nice way to massage the numbers. This athletic department is funny.

Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

But tbf, if they beat Tcu on the road that would start to change things

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It's the schedule we've played. And it's been comparable to most of our peers, who have not been as successful over that same stretch.

Either way, winning eight of your last nine conference games and 10 of your last 13 games overall is a good thing.

The doom and gloom here doesn't match the results. And it's weird.

I understand it to a degree because we're really frustrating to watch and fans can almost never go into a game feeling confident that we will win. But the results are what they are. And at the end of the day, you play to win the game.

I agree that the TCU game is a big one. But even if we win that one, most fans will just be waiting for the next loss to jump off the wagon again.

That's why I started the thread I did a week or two ago about program expectations. At some point, we need to agree on a set of expectations and standards and stop complaining if/when those are met.

congrats on a gutsy win. #1 is a dude. good luck the rest of the way.

bear2be2 said:

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Quinton said:

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Nice way to massage the numbers. This athletic department is funny.

Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

But tbf, if they beat Tcu on the road that would start to change things

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It's the schedule we've played. And it's been comparable to most of our peers, who have not been as successful over that same stretch.

Either way, winning eight of your last nine conference games and 10 of your last 13 games overall is a good thing.

The doom and gloom here doesn't match the results. And it's weird.

I understand it to a degree because we're really frustrating to watch and fans can almost never go into a game feeling confident that we will win. But the results are what they are. And at the end of the day, you play to win the game.

I agree that the TCU game is a big one. But even if we win that one, most fans will just be waiting for the next loss to jump off the wagon again.

That's why I started the thread I did a week or two ago about program expectations. At some point, we need to agree on a set of expectations and standards and stop complaining if/when those are met.

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Those folks will complain if we beat TCU just like with every other win.

tmcats said:

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congrats on a gutsy win. #1 is a dude. good luck the rest of the way.

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Good luck to you guys as well.

Unfortunately, it looks like y'all have taken the mantle from the 2022 Baylor, 2021 and 2023 Iowa State and 2024 Kansas teams as this year's hard-luck loser in the Big 12.

It seems like there's one team every year that loses a bunch of one-score games and ends up with a better team than their record would show, and it's looking like it's your turn in 2025.

I hope you guys get the ship righted the rest of the way, starting with a win over TCU next week.

boognish_bear said:

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Quinton said:

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Now go to the part that this is the worst stretch of big 12 opponents in the history of the program and it feels different. The schedule has been absolutely terrible.

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The B12 isn't what it used to be...but there have been a couple of wins over decent teams in this run.

2024
TCU finished 9-4
TT finished 8-5
WVU (at least was a bowl team)

Not murderers row...but not all cellar dwellers

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For whatever reason, Dave has been excellent against Tech, I'll give him that.

There are now 4 teams left without a conference loss: BYU, TT, ASU, Cincy

That was a nice win for Cincy over ISU yesterday. Could Cincy be this year's ASU?

Updated odds to win the Big 12, via @PFSNcollege FPM:

1) Texas Tech: 32.8%
2) Arizona State: 18.8%
3) BYU: 15.2%
4) Cincinnati: 10.3%
5) Iowa State: 6.9%
6) Utah: 5.7% pic.twitter.com/mhFZuBpS6P

— Cam Mellor (@CamMellor) October 5, 2025

boognish_bear said:

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There are now 4 teams left without a conference loss: BYU, TT, ASU, Cincy

That was a nice win for Cincy over ISU yesterday. Could Cincy be this year's ASU?

Updated odds to win the Big 12, via @PFSNcollege FPM:

1) Texas Tech: 32.8%
2) Arizona State: 18.8%
3) BYU: 15.2%
4) Cincinnati: 10.3%
5) Iowa State: 6.9%
6) Utah: 5.7% pic.twitter.com/mhFZuBpS6P

— Cam Mellor (@CamMellor) October 5, 2025

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They're playing really well. That's a much better team than I thought they were watching a couple of their early-season games.

Iowa state lost both starting corners. That fundamentally changes your defensive scheme. Cincy is still a big question mark. We really won't know what they are until we play them.

BUATX2000 said:

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Iowa state lost both starting corners. That fundamentally changes your defensive scheme. Cincy is still a big question mark. We really won't know what they are until we play them.

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Those are major losses, obviously. But Cincinnati ran all over Iowa State yesterday, too. That's a good offensive football team.

I think we'll have a lot of success against their defense. Our game will probably look a lot like their game against Kansas.

bear2be2 said:

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BUATX2000 said:

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Iowa state lost both starting corners. That fundamentally changes your defensive scheme. Cincy is still a big question mark. We really won't know what they are until we play them.

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Those are major losses, obviously. But Cincinnati ran all over Iowa State yesterday, too. That's a good offensive football team.

I think we'll have a lot of success against their defense. Our game will probably look a lot like their game against Kansas.

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Bad take. Really bad.

ISU played Tampa 2 almost the entire game to protect the CBs and it left them vulnerable to the run game.
To act like the two items are not directly connected is nonsense.

Adriacus Peratuun said:

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bear2be2 said:

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BUATX2000 said:

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Iowa state lost both starting corners. That fundamentally changes your defensive scheme. Cincy is still a big question mark. We really won't know what they are until we play them.

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Those are major losses, obviously. But Cincinnati ran all over Iowa State yesterday, too. That's a good offensive football team.

I think we'll have a lot of success against their defense. Our game will probably look a lot like their game against Kansas.

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Bad take. Really bad.

ISU played Tampa 2 almost the entire game to protect the CBs and it left them vulnerable to the run game.
To act like the two items are not directly connected is nonsense.

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Iowa State always sits in a two- or three-high shell. That's what they do. Heacock's defense is the ultimate bend-but-don't-break scheme.

They don't always give up 260-plus yards on the ground.

Cincinnati has gone over 200 yards rushing in both of its Big 12 games so far, and Sorsby is a talented passer. To suggest their offense didn't have a lot to do with Iowa State's defensive struggles is absurd.

We had season tickets for probably 40 years or more starting in the 70s. We never left even in the 70-6 type games (we were the 6). We got to see the ride to incredible highs, but even those carry an asterisk for me because of the Fiesta Bowl and the Cotton Bowl....and I put that on the coaching staff as some of our players showed poor discipline time and time again, resulting in needless unsportsmanlike penalties and then of course, the distraction Briles himself created because of *****-footing with UT when all of our focus should have been on the game.

After travelling to game after game, we dropped season tickets sometime in 2016 or 2017. Most of it was some health problems that made me lose confidence in driving to the games, but some of it was just flat out getting to the point where having season tickets made us feel like we had to go to the games. This started in 2015. Sometimes it almost felt like a chore to go. I don't think it was taking winning for granted. I think it was just a sense of....well we climbed the mountain, what now? We saw success we could have never dreamed of or foreseen. Actually going to the game just didn't have the priority it once had for us.

Winning is not always the issue with a lot of people. I think the younger generation is no where near as interested in college sports as you and I might be. Then some of the older, but still young families, money is tighter than it used to be and they have young kids in soccer on Saturday which means they either don't go to the games or have to leave early to get back home. Also back in our day, for almost all games your only option was to go to the game or listen on the radio....if you lived close enough to pull in the radio station. There was also no social media or internet boards like this to exacerbate negative perceptions and opinions. It is too easy now to see the game without being there.

I will always be thankful for the success that we achieved and that we got to participate in it. In the seasons around 2000, anyone thinking Baylor football would ever even be remotely relevant was delusional....it just couldn't be imagined. But those fans that grew into their 70s and 80s over the last decade of so, can't or have lost the energy to go and are no longer there to support the team regardless of success....and they would support regardless of what they saw on the field.

Some schools have the alumni and student base to compensate for a lot of potentially empty seats. We don't. Most here are passionate concerning wanting the program to be successful. If you weren't, you wouldn't be participating. However, I think that you guys and gals are in the middle. Old enough to still have the "going to the game is important" mentality, but not old enough where you just don't have the health to see the game other than on TV.

I do feel for the students at the game. My daughter was there in the early 2000s. Sitting in the sun for 3 or 4 hours was brutal. I often wonder how many of those shirtless and hatless kids are going to be dealing with serious skin cancer when are are a little older.

I think an uptick on winning and showing signs of that being sustainable would obviously make things better, but I still doubt you would see a consistently full stadium as I think the dynamics of who goes to the games and why has changed the last decade. NIL and the portal also creates issues because it is sometimes hard to buy into anything as you can't get excited for the future because you don't know if you are going to keep your players. I will give Aranda credit on this front. He pretty much keeps the players that they want to keep. So, I would not mock the culture. There is something keeping them there. I recall each of the last two years, all the talk on this board was about how so and so was leaving......well they didn't.

As I see it, me nor you can do anything about any of these complaints we see here daily. I try to just enjoy the games as I scream at the TV. I do believe the program does have the objective to climb back to the top. There is no reason not to based on the money spent and the potential money to get in doing so. It is just harder these days to do so as it takes a lot more than just coaching talent.

Matt wells needs to fired, & Coach Kleiman held accountable, for this sequence right here. 2nd down HAD TO BE a running play to force use of clock or Baylor timeouts. 3rd down, same thing, especially after the pass on 2nd.

This is unforgivably bad situational football. #kstate pic.twitter.com/1OPRUSRc9y

— Sam Creagar (@screagar) October 4, 2025

The reality is that despite our increased effort, Kansas State handed us this game. I have my complaints about CDA, but I don't ever recall CDA being as poor of a clock manager as Wells was yesterday.

Guitarbiscuit said:

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The reality is that despite our increased effort, Kansas State handed us this game. I have my complaints about CDA, but I don't ever recall CDA being as poor of a clock manager as Wells was yesterday.

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It was really bad. I would be pretty pissed if I were a KSU fan. They had no reason to lose that game.

boognish_bear said:

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Guitarbiscuit said:

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The reality is that despite our increased effort, Kansas State handed us this game. I have my complaints about CDA, but I don't ever recall CDA being as poor of a clock manager as Wells was yesterday.

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It was really bad. I would be pretty pissed if I were a KSU fan. They had no reason to lose that game.

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That goes both ways, though.

We should have been up by multiple scores at halftime and let them hang around with a pair of red zone turnovers and a terrible defensive possession before halftime.

I was surprised to see our S&P+ postgame win expectancy was still positive yesterday. I would not have expected that.

boognish_bear said:

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Guitarbiscuit said:

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The reality is that despite our increased effort, Kansas State handed us this game. I have my complaints about CDA, but I don't ever recall CDA being as poor of a clock manager as Wells was yesterday.

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It was really bad. I would be pretty pissed if I were a KSU fan. They had no reason to lose that game.

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My level of pissdom with CDA has reached about a 9 of 10 at worst. But if I were a fan of KSU, I would check myself into the local mental health clinic.

It was one hell of a catch that he somehow almost made look easy. Trigg is something special. What a weapon.

Number 1 checking in at #1 on @SportsCenter Top 10 🥶#SicEm | @mtrigg_ pic.twitter.com/t0XdcqKKEC

— Baylor Football (@BUFootball) October 5, 2025

#Baylor HC Dave Aranda after a thriller on the Banks of the Brazos as the Bears block K-State's GW FG Attempt to improve to 4-2 on the season:

"That heart right there is us... What we've earned now is a higher standard. We're gonna reach that at this point forward." #SicEm pic.twitter.com/eWTc72LoTC

— Parker Rehm (@parker_rehm) October 4, 2025

Chris Klieman's one-score game record is now 5-10 over the last three seasons. Here is how that compares to the other coaches in the league who have been at their school during the same time frame.

K-State has played in the most one-score games and is 2nd worst at winning them. pic.twitter.com/yXEghOVhWM

— Mason Voth (@TheRealMasonV) October 5, 2025

Aranda said last week that he and Spavital are yelling at Sawyer to take off at times and he hasn’t. So I’m starting to think it really is a Sawyer choice. I understand wanting to stay upright. But here’s the thing, is unwillingness to run has hurt the team on its own.

— Royden Ogletree (@roydenogletree) October 4, 2025

boognish_bear said:

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Aranda said last week that he and Spavital are yelling at Sawyer to take off at times and he hasn’t. So I’m starting to think it really is a Sawyer choice. I understand wanting to stay upright. But here’s the thing, is unwillingness to run has hurt the team on its own.

— Royden Ogletree (@roydenogletree) October 4, 2025

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Yeah, never thought it was a coaching decision thing. He may be seeing ghosts after getting banged up last year. I'm hoping he works on it during the Bye and gets his wheels back in some way. We will need them.

They have certainly proven they can make dramatic comebacks. For my sports fan mental health let's try winning some where we arent digging ourselves out of a hole.

Keaton Thomas on Baylor's comeback win over K-State:

"When our backs are against the wall, that’s when we’re at our best. We saw that last year, and to be able to do that again this year with another group of guys, who are all hungry and tenacious about the sport, it's awesome." pic.twitter.com/JOkrQM7kbf

— Baylor Bears on SicEm365 (@SicEm365) October 6, 2025