Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

No there's not!!! The Capitol Police have every right to close a public building. Geez, what world do you guys live. A Nation can't close public buildings, no matter what? Even if it was open before, a group like that storms the Capitol with Congress in session they have every right to close

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed.

---

We some how survived nearly 200 years with the Capitol and grounds completely open to the public at all times and with no laws on the books about it.

[Campbell said that time was more than 70 years ago before any such laws have been on the books, 1946 was the first year a law as created that dealt with controlling public access to the Capitol. Congress tightened restrictions in the 1970s after a radical left-wing militant group set off a bomb in the Capitol and again in the late '90s when an armed assailant stormed past a U.S. Capitol security checkpoint]

Including through the war of 1812...all the way through World War I and World War II

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

No there's not!!! The Capitol Police have every right to close a public building. Geez, what world do you guys live. A Nation can't close public buildings, no matter what? Even if it was open before, a group like that storms the Capitol with Congress in session they have every right to close

---

I said its a debate to have about access....you Federal government boot licker.

The People of America own that mother f******* building and have every right to enter it and to protest their corrupt imperial government if they want.

The People had access to it unencumbered for most of our entire history since it was built!!!!

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

Is there any exception to the public buildings being open if one of the parties is trying to create a Reichstag Fire moment? Optics are important when you are talking about Threats to Our Democracy (tm).

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

No there's not!!! The Capitol Police have every right to close a public building. Geez, what world do you guys live. A Nation can't close public buildings, no matter what? Even if it was open before, a group like that storms the Capitol with Congress in session they have every right to close

---

I said its a debate to have about access....you Federal government boot licker.

The People of America own that mother f******* building and have every right to enter it and to protest their corrupt imperial government if they want.

The People had access to it unencumbered for most of our entire history since it was built!!!!

---

Not true

Wrecks Quan Dough said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

Is there any exception to the public buildings being open if one of the parties is trying to create a Reichstag Fire moment? Optics are important when you are talking about Threats to Our Democracy (tm).

---

The Reichstag fire is of course when a single party used a late night fire at the governmental capitol building to suspend the Constitution and deprive the people of their rights and outlaw other political parties.

It was very different from the people protesting inside the building.

The danger of a "reichstag fire event" is not a riot, or fire, or bomb in the capitol...all of which is mere physical damage that can be easily repaired....its the reaction of tyrannical government system to such an event.

[Nominal "protection of the state" is what allowed Hitler to use the Reichstag fire to thoroughly discredit his political opposition. It was the German communists -not Hitler's own national socialists- who had attacked the Reichstag. Thus, according to the logic Hitler had been presenting to the public long before the fire, the communists had proven themselves enemies of the German State by attacking a symbol of Germany: the Reichstag. And so by default, the communists had placed their opponents the Nazis in the role of Germany's protector]

Wow that sounds a lot like what the American Liberals have been doing since Jan. 6th.

Framing themselves as "protectors of the American State"....using the event as an excuse to try and crush their domestic opposition.


https://time.com/6137403/january-6th-political-violence/

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Actually, this isn't atypical. People come into the city. Commit crimes and litter. Then complain about crime and litter in the city.

Again, this protest could have just as easily been done in middle America. And if some glass had gotten broken? You can get a non Urban jury. Like the documents.

He only needs one. I'd bet if he's not guilty, he'd get 2 maybe 12.

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

No there's not!!! The Capitol Police have every right to close a public building. Geez, what world do you guys live. A Nation can't close public buildings, no matter what? Even if it was open before, a group like that storms the Capitol with Congress in session they have every right to close

---

I said its a debate to have about access....you Federal government boot licker.

The People of America own that mother f******* building and have every right to enter it and to protest their corrupt imperial government if they want.

The People had access to it unencumbered for most of our entire history since it was built!!!!

---

You have to have some structure! It can't all just be wide open for 360 million people to just come in at their whim. You have to provide some semblance of security for the elected officials. We are past the days of putting a huge block of cheese in the foyer! And having a Friday meet and greet!

We have one of the most compliant populations….

Government schools and media have created Team Red and Team Blue commies.

Whether it's "pay your fair share" or "submit and obey", y'all are just programmed to give more power over to government. https://t.co/7sRYZzwVTV

— LibertyToad ™ 🇺🇸 (@LibertyToad) August 2, 2023

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

Let's just make it official and codify two standards of justice:
- Republicans trying to overturn elections - criminal
- Democrats trying to overturn elections - fighting for "democracy"

---

If you have a proof of a Dem pressuring state officials to throw out votes, create votes or placing poll workers lives at risk, let's work together to have them prosecuted. This doesn't have to be you versus me.

If Biden or anyone loses Texas and then pushes for alternate electors or singles out central Texas as frauds in effect disenfranchising those voters, let's work together. I'd find that unacceptable.

---

There you go. From Politico of all places.

Trump was not charged with placing poll workers lives at risk - that's moronic. But to act like Democrats have not done the same thing as Trump for every election since 2000 means you do not want to work together.

Two things can be true at once:
1. I can dislike Trump and hate his stupid election crap - although there was more evidence supporting him than "Russian hackers stole the 2016 election:
2. I also am more concerned by the overall institutions and system and do not want to risk the Bill or Rights for political theatrics

If I take your word, you would support measures that would improve the integrity of our elections and improve the franchise for all? I hope I so, but I am suspicious you want to "work together" to do that. Part of the reason it is so easy for normal, intelligent people to be suspicious of results in part of the country is Klanocrats continual attack against any basic measures that improve our election integrity and the franchise for all.

Osodecentx said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

You can read the whole thing for yourself. It is sickening. But does it amount to criminality? The editors at National Review don't think so. They acknowledge that Trump behaved disgustingly, but say that building a criminal case on his actions is flimsy. You don't have to be a legal expert to wonder how on earth they are going to make stick a violation of federal civil rights law stick to Trump (the theory is that by trying to obviate some votes, Trump broke civil rights law a sign that the prosecutor is throwing whatever he can at Trump, hoping to make it stick).

---

It is sickening and disqualifying, but I don't think it is criminal.

---

That's exactly where I land. Again, it is possible for true things to be true at once for those that are not tribal hacks.

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

So you don't believe in the jury system? If he didn't do it, he won't be found guilty.

His problem won't be DC. It'll be Republican eye witnesses.

I think you'll be calling them "RINOs" instead of patriots.

---

You're insane if you believe our judicial system is sound and fair.

---

It's the typical not principles Klanocrats. The system is perfectly fair when a guy I hate is convicted but totally rigged and t'racist when Kyle Rittenhouse is not. #clownworld

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

And the 2020 summer of burning, looting, and murdering were "mostly peaceful" protests.

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

With a Jury pull in an area that's 86% hardcore democrat and an Obama appointed Judge who gave unwarranted jail sentences to J6 trespassers, the likelihood of conviction and jail time is high.

---

In the last election D.C. went for Joe Biden 92.15%....Trump only got 5.4% there

Our national capital is one of the most uneven and partisan cities in the entire Union.

To give you some example in San Francisco the vote only went 85% for Biden in the last election.

D.C. is not just partisan....its the most hyper partisan place in the entire USA.

---

From where I'm sitting, if you don't want to be charged with connoting a crime in a city, don't commit a crime in a city.

They could have attached the Georgia of Wyoming state house. Then he'd have a more favorable jury pool.

---

You seem perfectly happy that the Left has turned the national capitol district into a one party ruled town.

One where conservatives have no shot of getting a fair trial.

But the National capitol district is where all Americans have a right to visit and to PROTEST against our increasingly tyrannical Federal super state.

Staging a protest against a national election at the Wyoming state house is a waste of time.

All power is in D.C.

---

Jan 6th, was not a protest. They stormed the Capital. That is a bit different.

If they simply convened outside there would have been no arrests.

---

They entered a public tax payer owned building? Now that is a major crime.

Americans need to understand that government buildings are like Imperial palaces...they are off limits to vassals/peasants.

Not to mention they have charged at least 1,000 people for daring to enter the United States Capitol building. And many have been held since then in near solitary confinement in a D.C. prison since that event.

[those being held pretrial are "not allowed to see their families, many times are not allowed to see their attorneys" and that "the food has been a major complaint. There's been complaints of it tasting like cleaner."]

[The detainees list several issues. The conditions allegedly include no religious services or visitations by family, "black mold" and "worms" on the jail's walls and in food, abuse by guards, and vaccine requirements for visits and other services.]

---

It was closed. The Capitol Police closed it and told them it was closed. The stormed the doors and attacked Congressional Chambers. They scaled the walls. That is not legal. I watched it on TV.

---

Let be clear...there is a major debate to have if public tax payer owned buildings....especially the United States capitol... have a right to be close to the public at all.

Heck even closing the Senate and House chambers to the people is itself a very questionable act.

Its why we have public galleries in the Chambers so the general public can keep an eye on what the politicians are doing.

The Floor of those chambers of course belongs to the two representative bodies....who may restrict access so that work/debate can take place...but the building itself belongs to the People.

---

No there's not!!! The Capitol Police have every right to close a public building. Geez, what world do you guys live. A Nation can't close public buildings, no matter what? Even if it was open before, a group like that storms the Capitol with Congress in session they have every right to close

---

I said its a debate to have about access....you Federal government boot licker.

The People of America own that mother f******* building and have every right to enter it and to protest their corrupt imperial government if they want.

The People had access to it unencumbered for most of our entire history since it was built!!!!

---

This might be the dumbest thing I've ever read on this site.

Congratulations. That was a high hurdle to overcome.

Just released Mike Pence video.

fubar: There are lots of candidates on this thread for the dumbest thing that I have ever read on this site.

Midnight Rider said:

---

fubar: There are lots of candidates on this thread for the dumbest thing that I have ever read on this site.

---

Yeah, I went back and read stuff from earlier only after I posted.

smh

FLBear5630 said:

---

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

---

So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Its based entirely on First Amendment protected speech.



A lot of this indictment is people telling Trump that something isn't true and him being his autistic self and believing it anyways.

No DC judge or jury is going to stop it and they're going to throw him in jail. Its not maybe, it will happen.

This will divide the country like you've never seen.

---

He has the right to free speech. This indictment says he went beyond that taking efforts to have millions of our votes nullified.

It's never good when Abe Lincoln indicts you.

---

He reminds me of John Brown with those crazy eyes.

Far from being an "attack on our sacred democracy"…Jan 6th will never cease to be a hilarious protest that showed us how gutless and easily scared our rulers are…

Forever giving us pictures of our demented and evil ruling class running down corridors and hiding from 55 year old Michigan blue collar welders and grannies from Alabama.

Hard to believe, but you've managed to best your own record.

fubar said:

---

Hard to believe, but you've managed to best your own record.

---

In fairness, it's not like he parroted the Russia Hoax, the Juicy Smalls attack, that Covington Kids attacked an Indian, that Georgia voting laws are "the new Jim Crow," that bleks are killed at a higher percentage by cops than whites, that Michael Ferguson said "hands up don't shoot," that Jacob Blake was unarmed, that Trump peed on Russian hookers, the Hunter Biden laptop was Russian disinformation, that a "sexy mama" mask from walmart stops rona, etc. ....

fubar said:

---

Hard to believe, but you've managed to best your own record.

---

I honeslty can not understand the people in this country who want to lick the boots of a bunch of corrupt politicians who spend trillions of dollars on wars in the 3rd world….wars that they then lose.

I am always just left stunned…

Redbrickbear said:

---

fubar said:

---

Hard to believe, but you've managed to best your own record.

---

I honeslty can not understand the people in this country who want to lick the boots of a bunch of corrupt politicians who spend trillions of dollars on wars in the 3rd world….wars that they then lose.

I am always just left stunned…

---

I'm not stunned. We are a nation of soft p#$$ies who won't get deeply involved nor can they be counted on to have your back when it hits the fan.

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

---

So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

---

In my opinion, yes. Clinton should be tried. Why Trump didn't, I have no idea.

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election. He did everything he is accused! If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime. He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong, instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs. Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

---

So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

---

In my opinion, yes. Clinton should be tried. Why Trump didn't, I have no idea.

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election. He did everything he is accused! If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime. He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong, instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs. Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.

---

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election.
Yes it does. Only banana republics have different systems of justice based on political party.

He did everything he is accused!
Provide evidence for crimes of intent.

If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime.
Correct. It is called the First Amendment.

He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong,
None of that is illegal. If we outlaw species lawsuits then virtually every regressive ambulance chaser is out of business and in jail.

instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs.
None of that is in the indictment. So did Biden. So did VP Brown. So did Clinton. Charge all or charge none. We are not a banana republic.

Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.
For what crime? Bloviation is protected by the First Amendment.

At the end of the day is your Trumpgasm worth overturning the Constitution. One of the thing that makes America America is people get to say stupid things - otherwise we would imprison every person that claimed kids should wear masks and not be allowed to go to school due to a disease that killed fewer of them than the flu.

Ironically, Klanocrat regressive prosecutors continue to make up specious legal theories to derail Trump while charging him with filing specious lawsuits. Irony never lost on regressive Klanocrats.

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

---

So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

---

In my opinion, yes. Clinton should be tried. Why Trump didn't, I have no idea.

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election. He did everything he is accused! If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime. He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong, instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs. Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.

---

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election.
Yes it does. Only banana republics have different systems of justice based on political party.

He did everything he is accused!
Provide evidence for crimes of intent.

If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime.
Correct. It is called the First Amendment.

He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong,
None of that is illegal. If we outlaw species lawsuits then virtually every regressive ambulance chaser is out of business and in jail.

instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs.
None of that is in the indictment. So did Biden. So did VP Brown. So did Clinton. Charge all or charge none. We are not a banana republic.

Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.
For what crime? Bloviation is protected by the First Amendment.

At the end of the day is your Trumpgasm worth overturning the Constitution. One of the thing that makes America America is people get to say stupid things - otherwise we would imprison every person that claimed kids should wear masks and not be allowed to go to school due to a disease that killed fewer of them than the flu.

Ironically, Klanocrat regressive prosecutors continue to make up specious legal theories to derail Trump while charging him with filing specious lawsuits. Irony never lost on regressive Klanocrats.

---

If you really want to dig in. If the Trump DOJ could have prosecuted Hillary they would have. The FACT that they never were able to bring charges shows that they couldn't. Where is the investigation, Grand Jury and indictment of Hillary? Trump had 4 years to do it. So cut the Banana Republic crap. Only in Banana Republics do they prosecute on TV reports. So, apparently Hillary was smarter and covered her trail better than Trump because Trump is indicted and no one has had enough to indict Hillary or Bill. Luckily for Donald, we are not a Banana Republic and he will be able to defend himself.

Actually, they are crimes! There are three indictments in place and trials set. Your point? What crime? Well, several different Grand Juries seem to think there are numerous crimes. Whether you like it or not, the DOJ did investigate, go through the Grand Jury and indicted in three different States (#4 in Georgia is coming). So all your speculation is just that speculation as he has been charged multiple times.

Don't tell me, it is a huge conspiracy all against Donald. All these prosecutors, all the Grand Juries, all the judges, and the whole DOJ is in on the conspiracy and got together at a big meeting to plan this across four states. At some point you have to look in the mirror and say that this may be a Donald issue, not a corruption issue.

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

He may have, but the question then becomes what law did he violate?

If being a crappy human being and trying to subvert an election were crimes, we would have lots of politicians in jail. I think Trump is a piece, but this seems to me a dangerous stretch.

Mothra said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

He may have, but the question then becomes what law did he violate?

If being a crappy human being and trying to subvert an election were crimes, we would have lots of politicians in jail. I think Trump is a piece, but this seems to me a dangerous stretch.

---

Being crappy isn't illegal. Nor is lying to us illegal. Filing appeals isn't illegal.

Trying to get millions of votes thrown out is. The fake electors is. Putting a target on the backs of poll workers in a Georgia should be illegal. Look at what Republicans are saying. They were in the room and they are singing.

Bug Light on me if I'm wrong.

An aside. I do find the move from "stolen election" to "lying is protected free speech" to be astonishing. Am I now reading, they knew they were lying?

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

Mothra said:

---

Mitch Blood Green said:

---

I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

---

He may have, but the question then becomes what law did he violate?

If being a crappy human being and trying to subvert an election were crimes, we would have lots of politicians in jail. I think Trump is a piece, but this seems to me a dangerous stretch.

---

Being crappy isn't illegal. Nor is lying to us illegal. Filing appeals isn't illegal.

Trying to get millions of votes thrown out is. The fake electors is. Putting a target on the backs of poll workers in a Georgia should be illegal. Look at what Republicans are saying. They were in the room and they are singing.

Bug Light on me if I'm wrong.

An aside. I do find the move from "stolen election" to "lying is protected free speech" to be astonishing. Am I now reading, they knew they were lying?

---

Name the specific law he broke.

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

---

So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

---

In my opinion, yes. Clinton should be tried. Why Trump didn't, I have no idea.

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election. He did everything he is accused! If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime. He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong, instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs. Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.

---

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election.
Yes it does. Only banana republics have different systems of justice based on political party.

He did everything he is accused!
Provide evidence for crimes of intent.

If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime.
Correct. It is called the First Amendment.

He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong,
None of that is illegal. If we outlaw species lawsuits then virtually every regressive ambulance chaser is out of business and in jail.

instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs.
None of that is in the indictment. So did Biden. So did VP Brown. So did Clinton. Charge all or charge none. We are not a banana republic.

Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.
For what crime? Bloviation is protected by the First Amendment.

At the end of the day is your Trumpgasm worth overturning the Constitution. One of the thing that makes America America is people get to say stupid things - otherwise we would imprison every person that claimed kids should wear masks and not be allowed to go to school due to a disease that killed fewer of them than the flu.

Ironically, Klanocrat regressive prosecutors continue to make up specious legal theories to derail Trump while charging him with filing specious lawsuits. Irony never lost on regressive Klanocrats.

---

If you really want to dig in. If the Trump DOJ could have prosecuted Hillary they would have. The FACT that they never were able to bring charges shows that they couldn't. Where is the investigation, Grand Jury and indictment of Hillary? Trump had 4 years to do it. So cut the Banana Republic crap. Only in Banana Republics do they prosecute on TV reports. So, apparently Hillary was smarter and covered her trail better than Trump because Trump is indicted and no one has had enough to indict Hillary or Bill. Luckily for Donald, we are not a Banana Republic and he will be able to defend himself.

Actually, they are crimes! There are three indictments in place and trials set. Your point? What crime? Well, several different Grand Juries seem to think there are numerous crimes. Whether you like it or not, the DOJ did investigate, go through the Grand Jury and indicted in three different States (#4 in Georgia is coming). So all your speculation is just that speculation as he has been charged multiple times.

Don't tell me, it is a huge conspiracy all against Donald. All these prosecutors, all the Grand Juries, all the judges, and the whole DOJ is in on the conspiracy and got together at a big meeting to plan this across four states. At some point you have to look in the mirror and say that this may be a Donald issue, not a corruption issue.

---

Let me explain it to you. Only in banana republics does the authoritarian government prosecute political opponents on specious grounds. Trump did not prosecute Hillary because James Comey stated it clearly - yes, she clearly committed treason and exposed classified documents to foreign governments, but we just don't prosecute political opponents because of the potential for abuse. This is not complicated. Trump and his DOJ respected polity and protocol and thought he did not need to prosecute Hillary because he never has been an vindictive authoritarian that wanted to turn the U.S. into a banana republic.

Of course it is a coordinated conspiracy against Trump. Anyone with a triple-digit IQ can see that. You're not so stupid as to not realize the mental gymnastics and specious legal theory required for this indictment. And it comes from a guy with a history of targeting Republicans with specious legal theories - the punishment is the process. This is little more than a way to distract from Bidenomics and the Biden global corruption to both keep the Democrat media focused on Trump to win the GOP nomination and (they hope) lose the general election.

Did you forget the DOJ laundered Russian disinformation from the Clinton Campaign to create the Russia Hoax?
Did you forget the DOJ targeted school board parents that opposed pedophilia in schools?
Did you forget the DOJ targeted churches that wanted to worship?
Did you forget the DOJ that told us Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian disinformation?
Did you forget the DOJ that raided a journalists home to retrieve Ashley Biden's diary as a political favor to Joe?
Did you forget the DOJ that tried to hoodwink the justice system with a sweetheart deal for Hunter Biden?

The difference is I am discussing actual facts and reality and you're having a Trumpgasm.

Again, it is possible to both oppose Trump's boorish behavior but obviously recognize it was not illegal. There is a reason these specious indictments cite laws in ways that has never been done. That's the exact definition of a banana republic.

My position is not one of love for Trump but of love for democracy and not becoming a banana republic.

Harrison Bergeron said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

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Mothra said:

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Mitch Blood Green said:

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I don't think Trump goes to jail but I think k he gets convicted because, he did that ***** He attempted to invalidate the vote of millions of Americans.

We saw it.

I think he gets convicted. He loses 2024. He appeals. He runs in 2028. He doesn't go away. This is a trilogy.

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He may have, but the question then becomes what law did he violate?

If being a crappy human being and trying to subvert an election were crimes, we would have lots of politicians in jail. I think Trump is a piece, but this seems to me a dangerous stretch.

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Being crappy isn't illegal. Nor is lying to us illegal. Filing appeals isn't illegal.

Trying to get millions of votes thrown out is. The fake electors is. Putting a target on the backs of poll workers in a Georgia should be illegal. Look at what Republicans are saying. They were in the room and they are singing.

Bug Light on me if I'm wrong.

An aside. I do find the move from "stolen election" to "lying is protected free speech" to be astonishing. Am I now reading, they knew they were lying?

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Name the specific law he broke.

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This is what he's charged with. I'll let you and jury decide if he did these things.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/08/01/trump-charges-2020-election-probe/

[Bear this in mind when you read today's column by David Brooks of the Times, who is totally onside with the Never Trump movement, but who dares to suggest to his readers that Never Trump elites might actually be the baddies.


Excerpts from Brooks:

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In this story we anti-Trumpers are the good guys, the forces of progress and enlightenment. The Trumpers are reactionary bigots and authoritarians. Many Republicans support Trump no matter what, according to this story, because at the end of the day he's still the bigot in chief, the embodiment of their resentments, and that's what matters to them most.
I partly agree with this story; but it's also a monument to elite self-satisfaction.
So let me try another story on you. I ask you to try on a vantage point in which we anti-Trumpers are not the eternal good guys. In fact, we're the bad guys.

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Brooks cites examples of how members of the professional class have changed economic, social, and cultural structures to favor themselves, at the expense of tens of millions of other Americans. More:

Quote:

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Does this mean that I think the people in my class are vicious and evil? No, most of us are earnest, kind and public spirited. But we take for granted and benefit from systems that have become oppressive. Elite institutions have become so politically progressive in part because the people in them want to feel good about themselves as they take part in systems that exclude and reject.
It's easy to understand why people in less-educated classes would conclude that they are under economic, political, cultural and moral assault and why they've rallied around Trump as their best warrior against the educated class. Trump understood that it's not the entrepreneurs who seem most threatening to workers; it's the professional class. Trump understood that there was great demand for a leader who would stick his thumb in our eyes on a daily basis and reject the whole epistemic regime that we rode in on.
If distrustful populism is your basic worldview, the Trump indictments seem as just another skirmish on the class war between the professionals and the workers, another assault by a bunch of coastal lawyers who want to take down the man who most aggressively stands up to them.

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To remind you: I believe that Trump's impeachment over his January 6 behavior was justified. I am skeptical of these new charges against him. They might be valid, but that will have to be demonstrated. Though I am a member of David Brooks's class, I have zero trust in establishment institutions. None.
Remember, they told us that Trump was a Manchurian candidate in Russia's pocket. It was a lie, and the media talked itself into believing this lie, according to the Columbia Journalism Review's postmortem. The ruling class told us that children were not being subjected to chemical and surgical sex changes but that was a lie, as we know thanks in large part to Christopher Rufo publicizing leaks. The ruling class told us lies about Covid. The ruling class knew Hunter Biden's laptop was real, but the FBI appears to have lied about it to social media giants in an effort to help the Biden campaign; fifty or so former top intelligence officials signed a letter testifying that the laptop was Russian disinformation. It was all a lie.
Now that it is emerging that the crackhead Hunter Biden's business derring-do actually did have to do with his father as vice-president, and looks for all the world like influence peddling, we are told by the ruling class that actually, yeah, okay, the Vice President was on the phone then, but he didn't talk business.

We could go on and on with the lies these people tell to advance their class interests, and their hypocrisies (e.g. white male Jason Aldean is History's Greatest Monster for his anti-crime "Try That In A Small Town," we must celebrate the gritty authenticity of incomparably more violent, grisly songs by black rappers). (Oh, and what about that Nashville trans shooter manifesto anybody heard anything about that lately?).

Though I think Trump is a bum, it is hard to get too worked up over the idea that he might beat this corrupt system.] -Rod Dreher

FLBear5630 said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Geez, give it a rest. Most people understand that we all most comply to laws to be a successful nation. Tribal, independence will get us nowhere.

This idea that the Colonist were united to fight big Government is ridiculous. Only 30% of the Colonists wanted to fight England. 20% were outright loyalist, the majority just wanted to live their lives. Even the 30% tried to work out it out with the British for 11 years, wanting to follow the laws if they could.

This notion that indicting Trump for 2020 is preposterous, is BS. He tried to install his own electors, at the very least it should be tried.

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So did Clinton in 2016. Should she be tried?

This breaks into basically three camps:

1. Trump is the most luxurious president we've ever had. He's never done anything wrong.

2. Trump did some stupid ****, but it was not criminal, and previous politicians have done the same and unprosecuted. We don't throw out the Bill of Rights and become a banana republic because of our Trumpgasm.

3. Trumpgasms showing each other their T Face.

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In my opinion, yes. Clinton should be tried. Why Trump didn't, I have no idea.

But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election. He did everything he is accused! If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime. He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong, instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs. Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.

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But, the fact she wasn't doesn't give Donald a pass for his actions after the 2020 election.
Yes it does. Only banana republics have different systems of justice based on political party.

He did everything he is accused!
Provide evidence for crimes of intent.

If you notice, the arguments against are not whether he did it but whether he should be charged or if they are really a crime.
Correct. It is called the First Amendment.

He tried to coerce votes, submit alternate electors, he pressured Pence, he put out false statements as an elected official, brought law suits he knew were wrong,
None of that is illegal. If we outlaw species lawsuits then virtually every regressive ambulance chaser is out of business and in jail.

instigated a crowd to storm Congress, and he did take the docs.
None of that is in the indictment. So did Biden. So did VP Brown. So did Clinton. Charge all or charge none. We are not a banana republic.

Bottomline is he tried to prevent the transfer of power. There is no doubt he was outwardly against the transfer of power and took actions to get around it. So, sorry yes at the very least it should be tried.
For what crime? Bloviation is protected by the First Amendment.

At the end of the day is your Trumpgasm worth overturning the Constitution. One of the thing that makes America America is people get to say stupid things - otherwise we would imprison every person that claimed kids should wear masks and not be allowed to go to school due to a disease that killed fewer of them than the flu.

Ironically, Klanocrat regressive prosecutors continue to make up specious legal theories to derail Trump while charging him with filing specious lawsuits. Irony never lost on regressive Klanocrats.

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If you really want to dig in. If the Trump DOJ could have prosecuted Hillary they would have. The FACT that they never were able to bring charges shows that they couldn't. Where is the investigation, Grand Jury and indictment of Hillary? Trump had 4 years to do it. So cut the Banana Republic crap. Only in Banana Republics do they prosecute on TV reports. So, apparently Hillary was smarter and covered her trail better than Trump because Trump is indicted and no one has had enough to indict Hillary or Bill. Luckily for Donald, we are not a Banana Republic and he will be able to defend himself.

Actually, they are crimes! There are three indictments in place and trials set. Your point? What crime? Well, several different Grand Juries seem to think there are numerous crimes. Whether you like it or not, the DOJ did investigate, go through the Grand Jury and indicted in three different States (#4 in Georgia is coming). So all your speculation is just that speculation as he has been charged multiple times.

Don't tell me, it is a huge conspiracy all against Donald. All these prosecutors, all the Grand Juries, all the judges, and the whole DOJ is in on the conspiracy and got together at a big meeting to plan this across four states. At some point you have to look in the mirror and say that this may be a Donald issue, not a corruption issue.

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Go ahead, put him in prison and see what happens.

I dare the neoliberal establishment to do so.

You want to break this country in half for real?