Is God in control? 2nd Attempt

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Waco1947
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12:28p, 10/26/18
Do you believe it?
What does it mean to you?
Is God in control of physics?
Tx Scientist if you want argue God is not in control then start your own thread.
I am trying to understand how people arrive at this faith statement.
I am not asking because I missed it in seminary but I am asking how disciples on this forum came to believe it.
1) Is God in control of events,
2) relationships
3) physics (physical forces - gravity, tornadoes, hurricanes, etc)
Waco1947
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YoakDaddy
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12:44p, 10/26/18
Calvinism vs. Arminianism....hmmmm...
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GoneGirl
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1:03p, 10/26/18
I don't believe so.

Even when I still believed in God--which I have slowly stopped doing over the past 10 years--I did not believe He exerted control over us. What I believed--particularly based on my own experience after my parents were killed by a drunken driver--is that God offered the inner strength and resources to cope with chaos. I was surprised, given the questioning nature of my faith, to find that it somehow gave me a foundation to stand in the two years following both of my parents' deaths, which came 9 months apart. It seemed as if God didn't care about my doubts, and He was there for me.

But I am now watching us literally wreck the planet our lives depend on, for no better reason than money, and the people who are most vociferous in denying climate change or most indifferent or in denial of the human impact on the planet are people of faith. Several of the true believers on this site, particularly the anti-abortion contigent, are also among the rudest, scornful, demeaning and abusive commentators. If their faith gives them such a superiority complex that they feel justified in demeaning and talking down to anyone who doesn't share their views on every issue, people of other faiths (including Islam, a faith tradition I also don't like), people of color and women in general and, finally, anyone who doesn't think Donald Trump is the greatest, I want nothing to do with it.

This makes me sad, because I was raised in that faith and educated in it, and while I no longer believe there is a God who knows the number of hairs on my head, I do believe we will either figure out how to live together and tolerate each other, or we will destroy ourselves along with the planet we depend on for our lives--and the rest of the animals and plants on it. One of the most destructive aspects of evangelical Christianity is that it exalts the role of man by giving him "dominion over the earth," and evanglicals focus on the "dominion" part without accepting any responsibility for exercising it wisely and well.

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Waco1947
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In reply to YoakDaddy • 6:03p, 10/26/18
YoakDaddy said:
Calvinism vs. Arminianism....hmmmm...
Please explain for those who are unfamiliar with terms.
Waco1947
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YoakDaddy
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In reply to Waco1947 • 9:39p, 10/26/18
Waco1947 said:
YoakDaddy said:
Calvinism vs. Arminianism....hmmmm...
Please explain for those who are unfamiliar with terms.

GTSB
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Oldbear83
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9:57p, 10/26/18
I'd like to address the topic. It starts with the Book of 'Job'.

A lot of people don't read the Bible, and those who do usually skip most of the Old Testament. The book of Job is especially difficult to digest, because of the apparent callousness of God. Here's His faithful servant Job, who is described as "blameless" in the text, who loses his fortune, his friends, his health and most of his family, just because God wants to prove to Satan that Job won't turn against God, no matter what. A lot of people have noted that it sure looks like injustice how Job is treated, except that God is GOD and you can't really argue 'Truth to Power' when the Power is Absolute.

But careful thought may reveal a different perspective and meaning. After all, while God rebukes Job for questioning Him at his low point, God also restores Job to health, wealth, and family, along with telling Job's no-good friends that they need to show respect and support to Job. It seems God operates on moral levels unknown to humans.

The science in this perspective shows up when we consider the Quantum Universe. Quantum Mechanics apply very different rules than we see in Einstein's physics, so much so that one type of quark is known as 'strange' for good reason.

God is farther above humans, than humans are to bacteria. It is therefore no mystery that humans cannot understand all of God's controls and rules for the multiverse.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
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Waco1947
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In reply to Oldbear83 • 10:09p, 10/26/18
Thank you old bear
Waco1947
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Waco1947
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In reply to YoakDaddy • 10:10p, 10/26/18
GTSB?
Waco1947
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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10:11p, 10/26/18
I don't believe God is a micromanager. I think he sets everything in motion and allows each individual to make their own decisions. Unlike the animals, God have us humans the ability to reason.

God is good.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
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Waco1947
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In reply to RD2WINAGNBEAR86 • 10:19p, 10/26/18
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
I don't believe God is a micromanager. I think he sets everything in motion and allows each individual to make their own decisions. Unlike the animals, God have us humans the ability to reason.

God is good.
Could God act on physics if God chose to
Waco1947
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JXL
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In reply to Waco1947 • 11:03p, 10/26/18
Waco1947 said:
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
I don't believe God is a micromanager. I think he sets everything in motion and allows each individual to make their own decisions. Unlike the animals, God have us humans the ability to reason.

God is good.
Could God act on physics if God chose to


Of course, just watch out for that "if."
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LIB,MR BEARS
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11:42p, 10/26/18
"23 Then he got into the boat and his disciples followed him. 24 Suddenly a furious storm came up on the lake, so that the waves swept over the boat. But Jesus was sleeping. 25 The disciples went and woke him, saying, "Lord, save us! We're going to drown!"
26 He replied, "You of little faith, why are you so afraid?" Then he got up and rebuked the winds and the waves, and it was completely calm.
27 The men were amazed and asked, "What kind of man is this? Even the winds and the waves obey him!""

"His disciples followed him" Even while following Jesus, a storm still came into their lives.

"the waves swept over the boat." I'm sure they felt as if they were overwhelmed and without control

"Lord, save us! We're going to drown!" 26 He replied, "You of little faith, why are you so afraid?" There is more here than I can unpack. However, in the "We're going to drown!" portion, among other things is the need to think eternally and trust in His plan.

"Then he got up and rebuked the winds and the waves, and it was completely calm." Here is the answer to the question in the thread.

(I think it would be interesting to have threads where we "unpack" stories from the OT and NT rather than finding points where we know there will be disagreement...and yes, I put my stone down because I wasn't going to throw it first)


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YoakDaddy
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In reply to Waco1947 • 12:34a, 10/27/18
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?

Google That Shlt B.....

Slang us middle agers use on NextDoor when folks ask questions they can easily google themselves.
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Oldbear83
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In reply to Waco1947 • 12:37a, 10/27/18
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?
Generic Taiwan Sushi Buffet

That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
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El Oso
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In reply to Waco1947 • 7:29a, 10/27/18
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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In reply to Waco1947 • 12:26p, 10/27/18
Waco1947 said:
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
I don't believe God is a micromanager. I think he sets everything in motion and allows each individual to make their own decisions. Unlike the animals, God have us humans the ability to reason.

God is good.
Could God act on physics if God chose to


I believe in the Big Bang theory. I believe God lit the fuse that set it in motion. The answer to your question is YES.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
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bearassnekkid
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In reply to Waco1947 • 1:07p, 10/27/18
Waco1947 said:
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
I don't believe God is a micromanager. I think he sets everything in motion and allows each individual to make their own decisions. Unlike the animals, God have us humans the ability to reason.

God is good.
Could God act on physics if God chose to
Yes, He is sovereign over everything in the universe, including physics, because He created it. He is even sovereign with regard to human free will, in that He is outside of time (his creation) and knows the result of every free choice. How much He chooses to "control" events in linear time is entirely up to him.
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Waco1947
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In reply to LIB,MR BEARS • 10:02p, 10/27/18
Again please cite which gospel.
Waco1947
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Waco1947
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In reply to bearassnekkid • 10:04p, 10/27/18
How is it you know God is sovereign? Bearass?
Waco1947
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Waco1947
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In reply to RD2WINAGNBEAR86 • 10:05p, 10/27/18
What is your support that God "lite the fuse?"
Waco1947
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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In reply to Waco1947 • 11:17p, 10/27/18
Waco1947 said:
What is your support that God "lite the fuse?"


My support? Most Christians call it faith.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
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LIB,MR BEARS
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In reply to Waco1947 • 5:57a, 10/28/18
Waco1947 said:
Again please cite which gospel.
Matt
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TexasScientist
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In reply to Waco1947 • 7:41a, 10/28/18
Waco1947 said:
Do you believe it?
What does it mean to you?
Is God in control of physics?
Tx Scientist if you want argue God is not in control then start your own thread.
I am trying to understand how people arrive at this faith statement.
I am not asking because I missed it in seminary but I am asking how disciples on this forum came to believe it.
1) Is God in control of events,
2) relationships
3) physics (physical forces - gravity, tornadoes, hurricanes, etc)
Ok, I'll stay in the realm of reality and out of the realm of mythology.
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Waco1947
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In reply to RD2WINAGNBEAR86 • 9:46a, 10/28/18
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
Waco1947 said:
What is your support that God "lite the fuse?"


My support? Most Christians call it faith.
So faith? Then does that faith reveal itself in the world through science that God can manipulate because God is in control even of science?
Waco1947
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Waco1947
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In reply to YoakDaddy • 9:48a, 10/28/18
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?

Google That Shlt B.....

Slang us middle agers use on NextDoor when folks ask questions they can easily google themselves.

Of course I can google it. I am curious at how you arrive at faith not Google.
Waco1947
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YoakDaddy
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In reply to Waco1947 • 9:54a, 10/28/18
Waco1947 said:
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?

Google That Shlt B.....

Slang us middle agers use on NextDoor when folks ask questions they can easily google themselves.

Of course I can google it. I am curious at how you arrive at faith not Google.

I said nothing about faith. You did. All I suggested was to google the terms on your own.
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Waco1947
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In reply to YoakDaddy • 10:01a, 10/28/18
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?

Google That Shlt B.....

Slang us middle agers use on NextDoor when folks ask questions they can easily google themselves.

Of course I can google it. I am curious at how you arrive at faith not Google.

I said nothing about faith. You did. All I suggested was to google the terms on your own.
Ok I agree you said nothing about faith. But I am still curious as to what you think not google.
Waco1947
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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In reply to Waco1947 • 10:02a, 10/28/18
Waco1947 said:
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
Waco1947 said:
What is your support that God "lite the fuse?"


My support? Most Christians call it faith.
So faith? Then does that faith reveal itself in the world through science that God can manipulate because God is in control even of science?
If we were able to see a ghost or see God part the Pacific Ocean, there would no longer be a need for faith.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
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YoakDaddy
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In reply to Waco1947 • 10:08a, 10/28/18
Waco1947 said:
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
YoakDaddy said:
Waco1947 said:
GTSB?

Google That Shlt B.....

Slang us middle agers use on NextDoor when folks ask questions they can easily google themselves.

Of course I can google it. I am curious at how you arrive at faith not Google.

I said nothing about faith. You did. All I suggested was to google the terms on your own.
Ok I agree you said nothing about faith. But I am still curious as to what you think not google.

I believe that I am a sinner who has been saved from eternal hell and damnation through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

I'm in Sunday School right now and my wife is giving me the stink eye for being on my phone. That's all for now.
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TexasScientist
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In reply to RD2WINAGNBEAR86 • 10:11a, 10/28/18
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
Waco1947 said:
RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:
Waco1947 said:
What is your support that God "lite the fuse?"


My support? Most Christians call it faith.
So faith? Then does that faith reveal itself in the world through science that God can manipulate because God is in control even of science?
If we were able to see a ghost or see God part the Pacific Ocean, there would no longer be a need for faith.
No comment.
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bearassnekkid
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In reply to Waco1947 • 10:59a, 10/29/18
Waco1947 said:
How is it you know God is sovereign? Bearass?
Others have alluded to it, but for me it is faith. Faith that is supported by the witness of creation (nature). It is also supported by a deep place in my soul that simply "knows", innately, that this is the truth of the universe. A whisper, if you will, that informs me that there is a God and that I was made to be in relationship with him (if I am honest and allow myself to hear it).

For whatever reason, He intended there to be a faith aspect to this relationship, a "choosing" to believe without direct incontrovertible evidence. This wasn't always the case, but is a consequence of free will (which resulted in a fallen world, but which is also necessary for any meaningful iteration of "love"). While we inhabit this broken place, on this section of the creation timeline . . . faith in a God that we are separated from and can't see (and more specifically, in the plan of redemption that He provided for us through Jesus) is how we are put back in right standing with Him.

So this faith, along with the revelations about Him contained in the Bible, is what colors my belief that there (A) is a God, (B) that He is the creator of the universe, and (C) that He is sovereign over all that He created.

Sovereignty almost goes without saying. It makes no sense to me that God might create something from scratch and then have no control over it. A bit of a logical conundrum, like "Can God make a rock so big he can't lift it." I believe God is sovereign over all He created, including His creatures' free will, because He is simultaneously inside and outside linear time, and as such He is/was aware "prior" of the result of every free will choice ever made, and knowing this He chose to create this particular universe. I believe God rides along with us and experiences linear time with us as part of the relationship He created us for in the first place, but He is not beholden to it. He can stir His finger in the events of Man any time he chooses, if he chooses, but He is already aware of how everything is going to turn out.
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TexasScientist
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11:03a, 10/29/18
No comment on psychosis.
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LIB,MR BEARS
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In reply to TexasScientist • 11:32a, 10/29/18
TexasScientist said:
No comment on psychosis.
No comment on arrogance
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TexasScientist
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In reply to LIB,MR BEARS • 11:41a, 10/29/18
LIB,MR BEARS said:
TexasScientist said:
No comment on psychosis.
No comment on arrogance
Ok. Lol
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bearassnekkid
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In reply to TexasScientist • 11:50a, 10/29/18
TexasScientist said:
No comment on psychosis.
Lol. You can apply whatever false label to my beliefs you want, but it just makes you look intolerant and foolish.

Pro tip: being smarmy and doing the faux-cocky thing is a horrible way to sway the hearts and minds of those you are attempting to influence. (That is your stated goal, right? To change the minds of us deluded simpletons?) I realize this is the preferred tactic of the atheist "stars" you idolize on the internet, but they're only reaching their echo chamber. You should rethink your strategy.

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