well, that's not going to happen, so what's your plan B?J.R. said:screw Trumps. He needs to go away now!whiterock said:won't hurt him as much as you might think in the primary. Everybody knows him and he's nearly unassailable with polls showing him in the 40-50% range.Ghostrider said:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/5d37ba/trump-koch-network-club-for-growth-megadonors
This will really hurt Trump.
It's the general where it would really matter......IF Trump wins the primaries (which is at the moment what is most likely to happen), will the donors who didn't back him in the primary step up to the plate for the general election?....or will they close their wallets and sit on them? That is a valid concern here.
I suspect that question is a big part of the reason why Trump endorsed McDaniel for party chairman - retaining ties to establishment donor networks.
Trump vs Desantis
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392 Replies |
Last: 5 mo ago by RD2WINAGNBEAR86
He's going to be the nominee so you can go ahead and vote for one of the commies or you can support America First.J.R. said:screw Trumps. He needs to go away now!whiterock said:won't hurt him as much as you might think in the primary. Everybody knows him and he's nearly unassailable with polls showing him in the 40-50% range.Ghostrider said:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/5d37ba/trump-koch-network-club-for-growth-megadonors
This will really hurt Trump.
It's the general where it would really matter......IF Trump wins the primaries (which is at the moment what is most likely to happen), will the donors who didn't back him in the primary step up to the plate for the general election?....or will they close their wallets and sit on them? That is a valid concern here.
I suspect that question is a big part of the reason why Trump endorsed McDaniel for party chairman - retaining ties to establishment donor networks.
đ¨Report: Those in attendance for Governor Ron DeSantis Donor & Influencer retreat include
— The Calvin Coolidge Project (@TheCalvinCooli1) February 25, 2023
Governors
Kim Reynolds
Kevin Stitt
Bill Lee
Senators
Tom Cotton
Mike Lee
Ron Johnson
Congressional
Thomas Massie
Chip Roy
Others
Adam Laxalt
Jim Lamon
Dana Loesch
2024 National GOP Primary Polling Trends by Echelon Insights among LIKELY voters
— InteractivePolls (@IAPolls2022) February 26, 2023
Jan. 23:
Trump 36% (+2)
DeSantis 34%
Pence 8%
Haley 2%
2-Way:
DeSantis 48% (+5)
Trump 43%
- -
FEB. 23:
Trump 46% (+15)
DeSantis 31%
Pence 9%
Haley 6%
2-Way:
Trump 53% (+11)
DeSantis 42% pic.twitter.com/pPqwx5JimG
Clearly Gov. Greg Abbott would be starting light years behind Trump and DeSantis. But 2 percent is clearly better than a whole lot of other GOP contenders who are kicking the tires on a presidential run. pic.twitter.com/VaZD0ujO2U
— Jeremy Wallace (@JeremySWallace) February 27, 2023
if you are polling behind Pence.. you need to not run for president.boognish_bear said:Clearly Gov. Greg Abbott would be starting light years behind Trump and DeSantis. But 2 percent is clearly better than a whole lot of other GOP contenders who are kicking the tires on a presidential run. pic.twitter.com/VaZD0ujO2U
— Jeremy Wallace (@JeremySWallace) February 27, 2023
âMix a little foolishness with your serious plans. It is lovely to be silly at the right moment.â
âHorace
âInsomnia sharpens your math skills because you spend all night calculating how much sleep youâll get if youâre able to âfall asleep right now.â â
âHorace
âInsomnia sharpens your math skills because you spend all night calculating how much sleep youâll get if youâre able to âfall asleep right now.â â
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
I have $1K says he won't. He is LOSER. He single handedly lost the Presidency, House, Senate, and was impeached 2 time. He ain't winning chit! Take me up.muddybrazos said:He's going to be the nominee so you can go ahead and vote for one of the commies or you can support America First.J.R. said:screw Trumps. He needs to go away now!whiterock said:won't hurt him as much as you might think in the primary. Everybody knows him and he's nearly unassailable with polls showing him in the 40-50% range.Ghostrider said:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/5d37ba/trump-koch-network-club-for-growth-megadonors
This will really hurt Trump.
It's the general where it would really matter......IF Trump wins the primaries (which is at the moment what is most likely to happen), will the donors who didn't back him in the primary step up to the plate for the general election?....or will they close their wallets and sit on them? That is a valid concern here.
I suspect that question is a big part of the reason why Trump endorsed McDaniel for party chairman - retaining ties to establishment donor networks.
Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
of course that's am eminently reasonable statement but Democrats flatly reject it, because they are immanently unreasonable.Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Jill Stein and Bernie Sanders would say otherwise, and they got enough support to at least complicate things.whiterock said:of course that's am eminently reasonable statement but Democrats flatly reject it, because they are immanently unreasonable.Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Mothra said:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Sam Lowry said:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Mothra said:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
âMix a little foolishness with your serious plans. It is lovely to be silly at the right moment.â
âHorace
âInsomnia sharpens your math skills because you spend all night calculating how much sleep youâll get if youâre able to âfall asleep right now.â â
âHorace
âInsomnia sharpens your math skills because you spend all night calculating how much sleep youâll get if youâre able to âfall asleep right now.â â
Well, if policies are any indication, we might want to be asking ourselves the same question about the current WH occupant.Sam Lowry said:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Mothra said:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Amen. That thought process, from a purported conservative, is simply remarkable.whiterock said:who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Further proof that our resident NT's are unable to see the forest through the trees. They prefer the Obamas and Bidens of the world to Republican presidents. Remarkable.
a lot of people call themselves "conservative" when they mean "not liberal." And the quiet part out loud..."not conservative" either.Mothra said:Amen. That thought process, from a purported conservative, is simply remarkable.whiterock said:who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Further proof that our resident NT's are unable to see the forest through the trees. They prefer the Obamas and Bidens of the world to Republican presidents. Remarkable.
I have one friend in particular, like balance, votes to maintain balance. flops around in voting choices. Hates radicals, moreso on the right than the left. (No it's not JR.)
It's like he never had a statistics class. Entering a factor of 48 or 52 has almost no impact on the mean. Its' the 99 or a 1 that has the real influence on the mean.
Fact is, the radicals are the ones doing the pulling. The smart centrists (mostly Dems) realize that and use that dynamic to their advantage in moving the mean left. The dumb ones (typically Republican) fight with their base to defend the mean, thereby leaving Dems largely unchecked in moving the mean left.
never fight your base. If you win, it makes your base smaller. If you lose, well...you lose.
Completely agree. I think that would aptly describe several of our purported "conservative" posters (see SL, LIQR).whiterock said:a lot of people who call themselves "conservative" when they mean "not liberal." And the quiet part out loud..."not conservative" either.Mothra said:Amen. That thought process, from a purported conservative, is simply remarkable.whiterock said:who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Further proof that our resident NT's are unable to see the forest through the trees. They prefer the Obamas and Bidens of the world to Republican presidents. Remarkable.
They generally are not. You and WR remain confused as to the difference between policy and character/fitness issues.Mothra said:Well, if policies are any indication, we might want to be asking ourselves the same question about the current WH occupant.Sam Lowry said:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Mothra said:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
See my previous post. I'm completely on board with moving the mean to the right, if moving right means moving to more conservative policies. If it means moving to more demagoguery and conspiratorial lunacy, not so much.whiterock said:a lot of people call themselves "conservative" when they mean "not liberal." And the quiet part out loud..."not conservative" either.Mothra said:Amen. That thought process, from a purported conservative, is simply remarkable.whiterock said:who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Further proof that our resident NT's are unable to see the forest through the trees. They prefer the Obamas and Bidens of the world to Republican presidents. Remarkable.
I have one friend in particular, like balance, votes to maintain balance. flops around in voting choices. Hates radicals, moreso on the right than the left. (No it's not JR.)
It's like he never had a statistics class. Entering a factor of 48 or 52 has almost no impact on the mean. Its' the 99 or a 1 that has the real influence on the mean.
Fact is, the radicals are the ones doing the pulling. The smart centrists (mostly Dems) realize that and use that dynamic to their advantage in moving the mean left. The dumb ones (typically Republican) fight with their base to defend the mean, thereby leaving Dems largely unchecked in moving the mean left.
never fight your base. If you win, it makes your base smaller. If you lose, well...you lose.
I know you repeat this mantra. But your actions speak differently.Sam Lowry said:See my previous post. I'm completely on board with moving the mean to the right, if moving right means moving to more conservative policies.whiterock said:a lot of people call themselves "conservative" when they mean "not liberal." And the quiet part out loud..."not conservative" either.Mothra said:Amen. That thought process, from a purported conservative, is simply remarkable.whiterock said:who will be packing the district and appellate courts with progressives.4th and Inches said:
While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.yet here we are with a mentally impaired president..Quote:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Quote:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Quote:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Quote:
And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?
judicial appointments are never a "less crucial" consideration.
Further proof that our resident NT's are unable to see the forest through the trees. They prefer the Obamas and Bidens of the world to Republican presidents. Remarkable.
I have one friend in particular, like balance, votes to maintain balance. flops around in voting choices. Hates radicals, moreso on the right than the left. (No it's not JR.)
It's like he never had a statistics class. Entering a factor of 48 or 52 has almost no impact on the mean. Its' the 99 or a 1 that has the real influence on the mean.
Fact is, the radicals are the ones doing the pulling. The smart centrists (mostly Dems) realize that and use that dynamic to their advantage in moving the mean left. The dumb ones (typically Republican) fight with their base to defend the mean, thereby leaving Dems largely unchecked in moving the mean left.
never fight your base. If you win, it makes your base smaller. If you lose, well...you lose.
No, we just have the ability to see the forest through the trees.Sam Lowry said:They generally are not. You and WR remain confused as to the difference between policy and character/fitness issues.Mothra said:Well, if policies are any indication, we might want to be asking ourselves the same question about the current WH occupant.Sam Lowry said:A conservative judiciary is always important, but it was less crucial as an election issue in 2020. We knew that whoever was elected in 2016 was likely to have a major effect on the Supreme Court. In 2020, we had a conservative majority in place and were free to consider other questions about our candidate for president. Like for example...is he sane?Mothra said:But a conservative judiciary became less important in 2020? What about the other things I mentioned? Nuclear war? Illegal immigration? Were those also less important in 2020?Sam Lowry said:It wouldn't have been overturned when it was. That's part of why I voted for Trump in 2016.Mothra said:And yet, it wouldn't have happened without Trump's appointments. If HRC had won, think Roe would have been overturned?Sam Lowry said:While I appreciate Trump's court appointments, overturning Roe wasn't the work of one man. It was the work of decades. That's not an excuse for anything. It's a needed perspective, in my opinion, for Republicans who seem to be permanently locked in panic mode.Mothra said:Sure, Democrats are going to win elections sometimes, especially when people who call themselves conservatives sit at home or vote for someone other than the conservative. That's part of my point. When your own actions play a role in getting Democrats elected, kind of silly to use the excuse, "Democrats get elected sometime."Sam Lowry said:It is a big deal, especially the foreign policy aspect. But I don't know whether you've noticed there's not much difference between mainstream Republicans and Democrats in that realm. A Romney or a McCain could very easily have put us in the same position with regard to Russia and Ukraine. The same criticism can be made to a large degree on immigration and the budget. Even some of our worst court decisions of late, like Obergefell and Bostock, were written by Republican judges.Mothra said:What new conservative ideas do you think were brought into the party as a result of the 8 year of Obama that you preferred to conservative rule? And what conservative ideas do you expect the party to usher in after 8 years of Biden wokeness?Sam Lowry said:Yes, it was arguably worth it to bring some new ideas (actually old conservative ideas) into the party. You're so afraid of Democrats that you can't see past next year.Mothra said:Sam Lowry said:It's not even necessary to assume that. If everyone had voted their conscience, he would likely have been removed and disqualified.Mothra said:Right, because only unprincipled politicians could have voted against impeachment.Sam Lowry said:We needed ten more men or women of principle in the Republican Senate. So yeah, very little chance.Mothra said:You and I both know that had little chance of succeeding.Sam Lowry said:Too bad we didn't have a chance to impeach and disqualify him, huh?Mothra said:
I think the only way it's not Trump is if the other nominees drop out and let DeSantis go after him mano a mano. If that happens, I like DeSantis's chances.
Otherwise, I think we can expect another 6 years of Democrat rule.
What's the plan for getting more principled politicians? Sit out more elections?
Yes, sitting out elections is sometimes a good plan. It's part of the reason that Romney/McCain types no longer dominate the party.
So never mind that it got us 8 years of Obama, which of course set the stage for 4 years of Biden. You preferred 12 years of those liberal disasters to McCain and Romney?
Yes your non-vote certainly did us wonders. Great decision there. Way to see the forest through the trees.
And I take it you're ok or willing to suffer the consequences of 8 years of wokeness so perhaps someone with different conservative ideas can get elected the next time in 2028? You don't see any lasting damage with a bellicose foreign policy that could lead to an armed conflict with, say, Russian or China, perhaps even nuclear war? Open borders no issue for you? The damage done with millions of illegal immigrants flooding the country over an 8 year period is just something you're willing to accept? Or liberal judges appointed to all levels of the federal judiciary just isn't that big a deal? Out of control spending and runaway debt - just one of the casualties of teaching those Republicans a lesson?
Or is it just all of the above really isn't that big of a deal for you?
Democrats are going to win some elections sometimes. Roughly half the country are Democrats. We have to accept that fact and learn to work with it if we want to achieve our long term goals.
Don't necessarily disagree with you that Dems sometimes don't look all that different than Republicans on certain issues, but I think you downplay the differences, especially those between Trump and Biden. If Trump were president, think we would be on the precipice of war with Russia? Think we would have 2 million illegals flowing through our borders on a yearly basis? Think we would have gotten Roe overturned?
Of course not. And yet, this is what you prefer. Remarkable.
How a president governs and reacts to world events may indeed be an indication of his character/fitness. For all of his supposed character/fitness issues, Trump's policies demonstrated a lot more sanity and logic than his successor.