whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Dude. Developers are not the reason housing costs are so high......

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The RFPs are put out by TXDOT, they are selling the user fees to build the road. So, now you are not only paying tolls but a 15-20% profit margin built in. Check out who owns the Companies, they are usually European or Australian.

So, they take profit, don't provide for the infrastructure and leave the County and City holding the bag. Yup, about right. Hedge funds then make out like bandits. Ag land gone, County having to provide millions in infrastructure and the developer invests in Asia...

BS, the property they are buying is under blacktop. Talk to some of the DOT Eminent Domain guys for what really happens.

Yeah, see who comes in and buys from the owners. 9 out 0f 10 it is someone that came in and bought when they saw a road was scheduled. But, that is not eating at the public trough, right? Because you would do it, so it is cool, "good capitalism". Otherwise, it is the nasty Dems, bankrupting America. You and the GOP are just as guilty, just different means.

Dude, I wrote a published Best Practices for Corridor Preservation. Don't tell me how great it is for a Developer to drop 5000 units 12 miles outside of town on Ag land because the Farmer died and the kids sell it. Corridor Preservation is a huge issue, no one wants to do ED and rightly so. ED is a last resort, usually because some ******* bought it up 6 monts before the contract was let. It take 12 months for public sector to hire a contractor. It takes less than 6 months to buy property, do the math.

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You're kinda all over the map. 130-loop around Austin was done by a Spanish outfit. You seem to be suggesting that they should have also done infrastructure for the subsequent residential and commercial development along the frontage (which was at the time way the hell out in the country). That's nuts. The State doesn't do that on new highway construction. Why should a private entity do it for a toll road? CIty of Austin has for 50 years wanted to develop eastwards, placed all its energies & planning there, yet raced west out into the hill country despite the city doing everything it could to stop/delay it. FINALLY, when the Toll Road went in, the eastward development kicked off in earnest. The MARKET wanted to go west, but the PEOPLE via their elected representative, wanted to go east. And it is entirely appropriate in such a circumstances for the PEOPLE to make the investment in infrastructure....to create such conditions as are necessary to force the market to go where the market does not otherwise want to go.

Like you said. The highway plans are public knowledge. Those with capital choose to invest where the roads will go. Completely expected in a free market. Poor people don't invest......rich people do.

You're infantilizing the original owners. THEY know why the developer wants the property. And they choose to sell (sometimes to avoid the ED). You know the steps. You don't negotiate in ED. You accept, or you litigate. (our family did....got 5x the offer at mediation, then settled for half-that when state appealed). Process is not for the faint of heart, and particularly cruel on those who are ignorant and dumb - who don't even know who to call for help on what to do. Complexity always hits hardest those least able to deal with it.

I'm a local elected official, so see a different angle than you do. ED and public P&Z issues are not unlike Federal budgeting. Messy places where sausage gets made. Nobody's happy, not even the developers. But somehow, usually, the ship of state waddles & squiggles mostly forward to a mostly beneficial place. And the grease that makes it all happen is tax money and private profit........ The key is not to focus on efficiency, but rather effectiveness - did things get there they needed to get. If they did....well....they did.....

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They are public/private partnerships, the State allows those deals to happen and manages them through TxDOT, CTR or NTTA. They are done through Design Builds. availability payments, or a whole host of other financing tools. If lucky, may be able to get TIFIA at a sweetheart rate. I work in for a toll authority, I am ALL FOR toll roads. They are operated as close to private sector as any Government entitiy by either TxDOT or a Toll Aurthority. We get no tax dollars and live 100% on user fees. If we screw up the road and no one uses it, we go belly up and lose our jobs. Toll road/User Fee Revenue Agencies are great. GOP should love them

As for your other comments, rich people invest. Yeah, going to an MPO meeting finding out where road routes are going to be and buying the land in front of it to get to ED Court, same as Municipal Bonds. Buying property in front of a road project to have the Government pay you is not different from the others at the trough. You electeds just do it so it is rationalized as OK. It is no different than the Defense Contractor, the State Employee, or anyone else getting a check for something land, time, or a screws. No different, the check comes from DC or Austin with public funds. Whatever you need to tell yourself Dude. You are a regular Milton Friedman...

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I am quite a fan of Uncle Miiltie, actually. I also live in the real world - a little community that would be much improved by the kind of breakneck growth you decry. There are small communities all over the country that cannot afford to fix the streets or sewers in place because they don't have enough sales tax revenue. You cannot run a city (easily anyway) on property tax revenue. You've gotta have long retail streets with sales tax generators. And to get those, you have to have subdivisions scattered about. The cities fortunate enough to be in a growth area and have room to expand are going to take advantage of it.....for the benefit of all. It's quite a wealth transfer. the New Growth generates the revenue to take care of the older stuff. And, yes, people are going to make money while all that happens.

What are you going to do, prevent all private treaty sales within a designated future corridor? For how long? By whom? Who oversees it? A govt. office somewhere? A commission? Is not a willing seller/willing buyer transaction a better gauge of value than a government hired appraiser? You think an arbitration hearing or court appeal is superior to market transaction?

The scenarios you raise are also not applicable in all cases. Nobody is going to buy farm land in Abbott Texas because of the widening of I-35. If they did so for the 130 loop around Austin, it took better than a decade of mowing cattle pasture before there was any development, so it was hardly a hotcake flipping program. I-35 past campus was a very poor & declining neighborhood. The man after whom that section of freeway (Jack Kultgen, local businessman, civic leader) saw I35 as a great opportunity for urban renewal. And, after about 50 years, it has finally paid off. Big money maker there...whoop-te-doo Nobody is rushing to buy lots in the ghettos of Philly or Chicago because of a new fly-oever being planned with stimulus money.

You are looking at a rather narrower scenario......fast developing suburban areas in fastest growing states in the union.

You're normally the practical one......

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Me too. Capitalism and Freedom is on my bookshelf at work, home and I gave to my kids when they turned 18. Yet, he worked for Universities his whole career that took Federal and State funds...

They don't have enough revenue because it is being used in other areas AND they are not allowed to raise taxes by elected officials. There is an optional 5 cent gas tax in FL, there are communities that are on 50 year resurfacing (12 is optimal, 15-20 normal) but will not max it. They let the roads go to ***** It is a narrow
example, but it is systemic.

I am practical, there is not enough money to provide basic services. There are 2 options, cut the services provided (often not an option) or raise more revenue. I get pissed when we get 4 year electeds or CEOs that slash and burn, tout how they saved money and then leave to let the rest of us deal with the fallout. Almost every elected officials net worth goes up after "serving". It is a problem, from local to Fed. They are artificially changing how Govt runs in response to Lobbyiest. Dem, GOP no difference, different master.

By the way, I know about small towns, especially in West Texas and the Plains States. Saddest things I have seen is watching places not having money for water purification with Benzene in the supply. Corporation kept appealing and using lawyers to not pay... Enough to piss you off.

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City of Waco has 2.5x the taxrate of the lowest municipality in McLennan Co, but because it has the preponderant share all of the commercial development, it's citizens actually pay a much lower overall tax burden than those of that lowest rated municipality given their water & street services that smaller communities will never be able to afford. There literally is not enough tax base in most small bedroom communities to keep streets on a10-15 year refurbishment cycle...at any reasonable tax rate. If you community has 2500 water meters to take care of +$100m worth of streets, those streets are going to get pretty rough. I could go on with more examples, but suffice to say.....
=bedroom communities are not viable municipal entities.
+unfunded mandates from federal and state govts are a contributing factor = significantly increase costs.

You are living in a dream world if you think getting elected to a school board or city council is financial enrichment exercise. Sure, maybe in a major urban area with organized criminal activity, anything can happen. But that is not representative of may thousands of taxing entities across the country. The pretty accurate rule of thumb is - the more seats in the institution, the less value each seat has. There's only 100 Senate Seats, 50 Governor mansions, etc.....while there are millions of city council and county commissioners offices. Guess who raises all the money?

You're letting your cynicism get the better of your thinking here.

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School Board??? That is just hell on earth!

Others?? Depends. I have seen both. Usually many use it to springboard to State Legislature. Or, they have pet interests they want to see pushed. In FL, it is the County Commission that has the power. In TX, Counties very weak.

People are cynical for a reason, it is usually what you see. Depends on the pond you play in. MacGregor City Council, you are right no one is getting upwardly mobile. Austin, San Antonio, Houston or Metroplex City Council??? Different stratosphere.

I stay away now. Too cynical.

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Here's your sign: by population, Waco is the 176th largest SMSA in the country. City Council is no stepping stone to anything. Alumni include a County Assessor/Collector of Taxes, a failed congressional candidate, etc...... Current statehouse rep toiled for years on various boards & associations, and GOP party stuff. Two candidates for that soon to be vacant seat are a businessman and a GOP county/state board leader. Such is typical for cities of the size in Tx.

Temple-Killeen is #118
Scranton PA is #100
Birmingham AL (just across the 1m pop line) is #50
None of those places are springboards to power.

You are talking about the very tippy top of the scale.......And even there, it's spotty. In Tx, the mayor of DFW, Houston, and San Antonio have occasionally stepped up for statewide, for a simple reason: those are the three big fundraising pots in Tx, so a city-wide elected has an edge in fundraising over others, to include Congressional types. (when you get further down into the weeds, you actually see that state and federal politics are two completely different tracks with crossovers the exception rather than the rule. Congress is a relative dead-end and the larger the state the more that tends to be the case.)

That is not to say partisan ideology does not impact at municipal level. It does. Larger municipalities are blue and their policies tend to reflect that........

If you want to find the seamier stuff, look to school boards, taxing appraisal, law firms, engineering firms, etc......lots of $$$ being flopped around there.

---

What you are not talking about is net worth before and after. The number of elected official that all of a sudden get smart with the stock market and real estate sales is incredible. Here are a few articles. Not meant to be conclusive proof, but you are smart and get my point. You can find these everywhere.

Escambia and Santa Rosa counties: How much are your elected officials worth? (pnj.com)

Nikki Fried's Net Worth Increases 416%, Tied to Former Cannabis Exec Tallahassee Reports

Personal Gain Index (U.S. Congress) - Ballotpedia

FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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whiterock said:

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FLBear5630 said:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Quote:

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Dude. Developers are not the reason housing costs are so high......

---

The RFPs are put out by TXDOT, they are selling the user fees to build the road. So, now you are not only paying tolls but a 15-20% profit margin built in. Check out who owns the Companies, they are usually European or Australian.

So, they take profit, don't provide for the infrastructure and leave the County and City holding the bag. Yup, about right. Hedge funds then make out like bandits. Ag land gone, County having to provide millions in infrastructure and the developer invests in Asia...

BS, the property they are buying is under blacktop. Talk to some of the DOT Eminent Domain guys for what really happens.

Yeah, see who comes in and buys from the owners. 9 out 0f 10 it is someone that came in and bought when they saw a road was scheduled. But, that is not eating at the public trough, right? Because you would do it, so it is cool, "good capitalism". Otherwise, it is the nasty Dems, bankrupting America. You and the GOP are just as guilty, just different means.

Dude, I wrote a published Best Practices for Corridor Preservation. Don't tell me how great it is for a Developer to drop 5000 units 12 miles outside of town on Ag land because the Farmer died and the kids sell it. Corridor Preservation is a huge issue, no one wants to do ED and rightly so. ED is a last resort, usually because some ******* bought it up 6 monts before the contract was let. It take 12 months for public sector to hire a contractor. It takes less than 6 months to buy property, do the math.

---

You're kinda all over the map. 130-loop around Austin was done by a Spanish outfit. You seem to be suggesting that they should have also done infrastructure for the subsequent residential and commercial development along the frontage (which was at the time way the hell out in the country). That's nuts. The State doesn't do that on new highway construction. Why should a private entity do it for a toll road? CIty of Austin has for 50 years wanted to develop eastwards, placed all its energies & planning there, yet raced west out into the hill country despite the city doing everything it could to stop/delay it. FINALLY, when the Toll Road went in, the eastward development kicked off in earnest. The MARKET wanted to go west, but the PEOPLE via their elected representative, wanted to go east. And it is entirely appropriate in such a circumstances for the PEOPLE to make the investment in infrastructure....to create such conditions as are necessary to force the market to go where the market does not otherwise want to go.

Like you said. The highway plans are public knowledge. Those with capital choose to invest where the roads will go. Completely expected in a free market. Poor people don't invest......rich people do.

You're infantilizing the original owners. THEY know why the developer wants the property. And they choose to sell (sometimes to avoid the ED). You know the steps. You don't negotiate in ED. You accept, or you litigate. (our family did....got 5x the offer at mediation, then settled for half-that when state appealed). Process is not for the faint of heart, and particularly cruel on those who are ignorant and dumb - who don't even know who to call for help on what to do. Complexity always hits hardest those least able to deal with it.

I'm a local elected official, so see a different angle than you do. ED and public P&Z issues are not unlike Federal budgeting. Messy places where sausage gets made. Nobody's happy, not even the developers. But somehow, usually, the ship of state waddles & squiggles mostly forward to a mostly beneficial place. And the grease that makes it all happen is tax money and private profit........ The key is not to focus on efficiency, but rather effectiveness - did things get there they needed to get. If they did....well....they did.....

---

They are public/private partnerships, the State allows those deals to happen and manages them through TxDOT, CTR or NTTA. They are done through Design Builds. availability payments, or a whole host of other financing tools. If lucky, may be able to get TIFIA at a sweetheart rate. I work in for a toll authority, I am ALL FOR toll roads. They are operated as close to private sector as any Government entitiy by either TxDOT or a Toll Aurthority. We get no tax dollars and live 100% on user fees. If we screw up the road and no one uses it, we go belly up and lose our jobs. Toll road/User Fee Revenue Agencies are great. GOP should love them

As for your other comments, rich people invest. Yeah, going to an MPO meeting finding out where road routes are going to be and buying the land in front of it to get to ED Court, same as Municipal Bonds. Buying property in front of a road project to have the Government pay you is not different from the others at the trough. You electeds just do it so it is rationalized as OK. It is no different than the Defense Contractor, the State Employee, or anyone else getting a check for something land, time, or a screws. No different, the check comes from DC or Austin with public funds. Whatever you need to tell yourself Dude. You are a regular Milton Friedman...

---

I am quite a fan of Uncle Miiltie, actually. I also live in the real world - a little community that would be much improved by the kind of breakneck growth you decry. There are small communities all over the country that cannot afford to fix the streets or sewers in place because they don't have enough sales tax revenue. You cannot run a city (easily anyway) on property tax revenue. You've gotta have long retail streets with sales tax generators. And to get those, you have to have subdivisions scattered about. The cities fortunate enough to be in a growth area and have room to expand are going to take advantage of it.....for the benefit of all. It's quite a wealth transfer. the New Growth generates the revenue to take care of the older stuff. And, yes, people are going to make money while all that happens.

What are you going to do, prevent all private treaty sales within a designated future corridor? For how long? By whom? Who oversees it? A govt. office somewhere? A commission? Is not a willing seller/willing buyer transaction a better gauge of value than a government hired appraiser? You think an arbitration hearing or court appeal is superior to market transaction?

The scenarios you raise are also not applicable in all cases. Nobody is going to buy farm land in Abbott Texas because of the widening of I-35. If they did so for the 130 loop around Austin, it took better than a decade of mowing cattle pasture before there was any development, so it was hardly a hotcake flipping program. I-35 past campus was a very poor & declining neighborhood. The man after whom that section of freeway (Jack Kultgen, local businessman, civic leader) saw I35 as a great opportunity for urban renewal. And, after about 50 years, it has finally paid off. Big money maker there...whoop-te-doo Nobody is rushing to buy lots in the ghettos of Philly or Chicago because of a new fly-oever being planned with stimulus money.

You are looking at a rather narrower scenario......fast developing suburban areas in fastest growing states in the union.

You're normally the practical one......

---

Me too. Capitalism and Freedom is on my bookshelf at work, home and I gave to my kids when they turned 18. Yet, he worked for Universities his whole career that took Federal and State funds...

They don't have enough revenue because it is being used in other areas AND they are not allowed to raise taxes by elected officials. There is an optional 5 cent gas tax in FL, there are communities that are on 50 year resurfacing (12 is optimal, 15-20 normal) but will not max it. They let the roads go to ***** It is a narrow
example, but it is systemic.

I am practical, there is not enough money to provide basic services. There are 2 options, cut the services provided (often not an option) or raise more revenue. I get pissed when we get 4 year electeds or CEOs that slash and burn, tout how they saved money and then leave to let the rest of us deal with the fallout. Almost every elected officials net worth goes up after "serving". It is a problem, from local to Fed. They are artificially changing how Govt runs in response to Lobbyiest. Dem, GOP no difference, different master.

By the way, I know about small towns, especially in West Texas and the Plains States. Saddest things I have seen is watching places not having money for water purification with Benzene in the supply. Corporation kept appealing and using lawyers to not pay... Enough to piss you off.

---

City of Waco has 2.5x the taxrate of the lowest municipality in McLennan Co, but because it has the preponderant share all of the commercial development, it's citizens actually pay a much lower overall tax burden than those of that lowest rated municipality given their water & street services that smaller communities will never be able to afford. There literally is not enough tax base in most small bedroom communities to keep streets on a10-15 year refurbishment cycle...at any reasonable tax rate. If you community has 2500 water meters to take care of +$100m worth of streets, those streets are going to get pretty rough. I could go on with more examples, but suffice to say.....
=bedroom communities are not viable municipal entities.
+unfunded mandates from federal and state govts are a contributing factor = significantly increase costs.

You are living in a dream world if you think getting elected to a school board or city council is financial enrichment exercise. Sure, maybe in a major urban area with organized criminal activity, anything can happen. But that is not representative of may thousands of taxing entities across the country. The pretty accurate rule of thumb is - the more seats in the institution, the less value each seat has. There's only 100 Senate Seats, 50 Governor mansions, etc.....while there are millions of city council and county commissioners offices. Guess who raises all the money?

You're letting your cynicism get the better of your thinking here.

---

School Board??? That is just hell on earth!

Others?? Depends. I have seen both. Usually many use it to springboard to State Legislature. Or, they have pet interests they want to see pushed. In FL, it is the County Commission that has the power. In TX, Counties very weak.

People are cynical for a reason, it is usually what you see. Depends on the pond you play in. MacGregor City Council, you are right no one is getting upwardly mobile. Austin, San Antonio, Houston or Metroplex City Council??? Different stratosphere.

I stay away now. Too cynical.

---

Here's your sign: by population, Waco is the 176th largest SMSA in the country. City Council is no stepping stone to anything. Alumni include a County Assessor/Collector of Taxes, a failed congressional candidate, etc...... Current statehouse rep toiled for years on various boards & associations, and GOP party stuff. Two candidates for that soon to be vacant seat are a businessman and a GOP county/state board leader. Such is typical for cities of the size in Tx.

Temple-Killeen is #118
Scranton PA is #100
Birmingham AL (just across the 1m pop line) is #50
None of those places are springboards to power.

You are talking about the very tippy top of the scale.......And even there, it's spotty. In Tx, the mayor of DFW, Houston, and San Antonio have occasionally stepped up for statewide, for a simple reason: those are the three big fundraising pots in Tx, so a city-wide elected has an edge in fundraising over others, to include Congressional types. (when you get further down into the weeds, you actually see that state and federal politics are two completely different tracks with crossovers the exception rather than the rule. Congress is a relative dead-end and the larger the state the more that tends to be the case.)

That is not to say partisan ideology does not impact at municipal level. It does. Larger municipalities are blue and their policies tend to reflect that........

If you want to find the seamier stuff, look to school boards, taxing appraisal, law firms, engineering firms, etc......lots of $$$ being flopped around there.

---

What you are not talking about is net worth before and after. The number of elected official that all of a sudden get smart with the stock market and real estate sales is incredible. Here are a few articles. Not meant to be conclusive proof, but you are smart and get my point. You can find these everywhere.

Escambia and Santa Rosa counties: How much are your elected officials worth? (pnj.com)

Nikki Fried's Net Worth Increases 416%, Tied to Former Cannabis Exec Tallahassee Reports

Personal Gain Index (U.S. Congress) - Ballotpedia

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That first link is simply trash. "became a millionaire during their term in office...." is meaningless unless it indicates how long they were in office. it's also meaningless unless they cite where each of those officials started. It is quite common for local officials to be business owners, civic leaders, if not from wealthy families and/or married to someone of means (old money, physician's spouse, etc....). A very large percentage of them will choose to step into public life in the twilight of their careers, to "give back," etc.... Two 4-year terms is enough to to reasonably, at real estate and stock market averages, see a 50% increase in wealth just on investments, not accounting for additional savings added. Hell, the first picture in the article cited an official who had a one year increase in wealth of 3%. Big whup-te-doo.

Not making a terribly strong argument here for the locals.

Congress is a different story. They do know how law is going to move markets and they do the right to invest, so I'm not sure you you police that terribly easily. But, again, a very high percentage of Congress-critters start off their political careers in the higher ranges of national income/wealth distribution. Those folks are going to make money one way or the other. Bill Flores (a profoundly wealthy member) self-funded his first campaign, to the tune of 7-digits. Then he sold his jet aircraft when he got elected = demands of the job would prevent him from being able to use it enough to justify the overhead and maintenance coupled with the substantial regulatory risk of business vs official use.

Mothra said:

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Frank Galvin said:

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The market "should" fix that. If no one can afford those homes, their price will decrease.

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I've read that the problem is, companies like Blackrock and other big corporations are buying up residential property like crazy, and then renting them out. Big business has discovered that investing in residential property is good for business.

Here in Austin, which is or at least was the fastest appreciating city in America, I have had 3 investors approach me about purchasing my house in the last couple of years. When we bought the home 8 years ago, it was a solid middle class home, production build, in a middle class neighborhood, and a bit of a fixer-upper. I could sell it today for more than 3 times what we paid for it.

That's insane.

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I bought my house in 2019 for $380k and an investor was offering $748k for it last year!

Age at which most residents of each U.S. state are homeowners pic.twitter.com/GXSC9Hlr8m

— Epic Maps 🗺️ (@Locati0ns) November 28, 2023

Translation - if you are White you will face discrimination. https://t.co/y4KkzJicQi

— RAMZPAUL (@ramzpaul) November 28, 2023

This is deeply evil and will actually threaten the Republic. pic.twitter.com/xrkkkO4ETw

— Ælþemplær (@Aelthemplaer) November 28, 2023

Redbrickbear said:

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This is deeply evil and will actually threaten the Republic. pic.twitter.com/xrkkkO4ETw

— Ælþemplær (@Aelthemplaer) November 28, 2023

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It is almost like illegal immigration and printing money to pay people to stay home for a couple of flu seasons are bad policies.

Hey Gen Z … are you ready for the future of tiny home ownership?

Or rent if you can afford to buy even this.

🔊

pic.twitter.com/hMQD4GEKTT

— Wall Street Silver (@WallStreetSilv) November 29, 2023

The answer to the OP continues to be Bidenomics.

The math for buying a home no longer works https://t.co/xaO4WqbPjb https://t.co/xaO4WqbPjb

— The Wall Street Journal (@WSJ) December 16, 2023

Totally normal: https://t.co/7Z9qzDapYb

— Hayden Clarkin (@the_transit_guy) March 3, 2024

Redbrickbear said:

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Totally normal: https://t.co/7Z9qzDapYb

— Hayden Clarkin (@the_transit_guy) March 3, 2024

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seems like only old people go to these meetings.. why is that?

Oh yeah, kids dont care about how the world works until it adversely effects them and its too late

[ol]
I would point out 2 main reasons like 1) housing prices have outpaced wage growth: In many areas, housing prices have risen faster than wages, making it harder for young people to save for a down payment or qualify for a mortgage based on their income. That is exactly my case. 2) Student loan debt: Many young people are burdened with significant student loan debt, which can impede their ability to save for a down payment or qualify for a mortgage due to their existing debt obligations. That is why I prefer to keep some crypto in my https://ownrwallet.com/about.[/ol]

MikeUsmane said:

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[ol]
I would point out 2 main reasons like 1) housing prices have outpaced wage growth: In many areas, housing prices have risen faster than wages, making it harder for young people to save for a down payment or qualify for a mortgage based on their income. That is exactly my case. 2) Student loan debt: Many young people are burdened with significant student loan debt, which can impede their ability to save for a down payment or qualify for a mortgage due to their existing debt obligations.[/ol]

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How to solve.

Seize the endowments from universities. They're selling false goods that don't have a ROI.

Get rid of entitlement programs like social security and Medicare and don't allow government to print trillions causing inflation and insane rates.

GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford. Ask Mamma.

drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford...

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Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

Redbrickbear said:

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drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford...

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Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

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That is a problem with the educational system, not housing prices.

Redbrickbear said:

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drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford...

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Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

Oldbear83 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford...

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Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

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I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

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Most that do want more house than they can afford...

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Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

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Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

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I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

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Depends on specifics. I agree that housing prices are too high and so are rates. But I also smell a bit of fear-mongering in the media, they love to sell panic especially to people who don't stop to consider they can plan their own way forward.

Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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drahthaar said:

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GrowlTowel said:

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Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

Depends on specifics. I agree that housing prices are too high and so are rates. But I also smell a bit of fear-mongering in the media, they love to sell panic especially to people who don't stop to consider they can plan their own way forward.

---

Probably close to $3K a month between mortgage, property taxes and home insurance. Around $35k a year. Average household is making $73k a year in salary before taxes.

It sucks for young adults in the late 20's and early 30's looking to buy their first home and they don't typically have a lot of cash to put down. They might be closer to 40 before they can get their first home.

Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

drahthaar said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

Depends on specifics. I agree that housing prices are too high and so are rates. But I also smell a bit of fear-mongering in the media, they love to sell panic especially to people who don't stop to consider they can plan their own way forward.

---

Probably close to $3K a month between mortgage, property taxes and home insurance. Around $35k a year. Average household is making $73k a year in salary before taxes.

It sucks for young adults in the late 20's and early 30's looking to buy their first home and they don't typically have a lot of cash to put down. They might be closer to 40 before they can get their first home.

---

I bought my first home at 38, so it's not all that different for some of us.

Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

drahthaar said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

I do agree with interest rate hurdle . It really makes a difference. Also, I live basically in Downtown in a high rise where there are a lot of young people and they don't want a house. Even the married ones. As we discussed, they spend their money on experiences and don't want to be tied down to the burbs. Not sure if that is prudent or not, but it is what it is.

Further evidence how the American standard of living continues to plummet.

But the folks most adversely affected still usually vote Democrat.

KaiBear said:

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Further evidence how the American standard of living continues to plummet.

But the folks most adversely affected still usually vote Democrat.

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Well you know what the Big Guy says: "If you don't vote for Biden, you ain't Black!"

J.R. said:

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Doc Holliday said:

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Oldbear83 said:

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Redbrickbear said:

---

drahthaar said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

I do agree with interest rate hurdle . It really makes a difference. Also, I live basically in Downtown in a high rise where there are a lot of young people and they don't want a house. Even the married ones. As we discussed, they spend their money on experiences and don't want to be tied down to the burbs. Not sure if that is prudent or not, but it is what it is.

---

Yeah lifestyles have drastically change and it may lead to a huge problem down the road. These people aren't going to have home equity or retirement money when they get old. They're also choosing not to have children.

There's also something I call the "status economy" where you have millions of people making stupid financial decisions to keep up with the Jones's. They're barely affording rent while leasing an $80k BMW. We absolutely have an issue with financial ignorance in this country. Tens of millions of people making stupid financial decisions.

Oldbear83 said:

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Doc Holliday said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

drahthaar said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

Depends on specifics. I agree that housing prices are too high and so are rates. But I also smell a bit of fear-mongering in the media, they love to sell panic especially to people who don't stop to consider they can plan their own way forward.

---

Probably close to $3K a month between mortgage, property taxes and home insurance. Around $35k a year. Average household is making $73k a year in salary before taxes.

It sucks for young adults in the late 20's and early 30's looking to buy their first home and they don't typically have a lot of cash to put down. They might be closer to 40 before they can get their first home.

---

I bought my first home at 38, so it's not all that different for some of us.

---

Nothing wrong with that, but it delays a lot of equity and potentially other things. High rates also make the cost of rent go up, which then makes saving much more difficult.

I just think we're in a situation right now where spending (money printing) is going to continue to increase over the years, along with taxes and rates that are going to be higher than what they're currently at.

I thankfully was able to build my first house at 29. I turned it into a rental a year later and built my current house with a 3% interest rate. I ended up selling the first house/rental and made $105k on it after only having it for 3 years.

I would love to have another rental right now, but can't justify it with these rates.

It does seem crazy to me the difference in costs between 2019 (pre covid) and now. 100k salary then is like 150k now and the value of my house has gonna up about that much or more since then. I'm glad I moved and got to where I am in 2017 and locked in a 3% rate. Now theres a dream house for sale in my neighborhood with a dock and boat ramp on the street but it would be a stretch and financially dumb for me to sell and sign up for a bigger mtg pmt at a much higher rate.

Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen says she regrets saying “inflation was transitory."

— unusual_whales (@unusual_whales) March 13, 2024

Just went under contract for a new built 2 story home.

4 bed, 3 bath
2000sf finished
850sf unfinished basement.

Tandem three car garage .
$ 532000

By the time I finish the backyard , put in fencing , central air , window coverings , upgrade the flooring and cabinets looking at about $ 570,000


Will rent for $ 2800 a month initially then $3000 the following year.

You have to feel for these people… truly.
Inflation is the tax of all taxes… they say inflation has gone down but that’s a lie.
They’ve removed data from inflation collection therefore showing it’s gone down but the overall fundamentals continually go up which is hurting still

— Mickamious (@MickamiousG) March 13, 2024

Redbrickbear said:

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You have to feel for these people… truly.
Inflation is the tax of all taxes… they say inflation has gone down but that’s a lie.
They’ve removed data from inflation collection therefore showing it’s gone down but the overall fundamentals continually go up which is hurting still

— Mickamious (@MickamiousG) March 13, 2024

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She looks attractive aside from the crying. Go get a husband and have him help you with the bills.

Doc Holliday said:

---

J.R. said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Oldbear83 said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

---

drahthaar said:

---

GrowlTowel said:

---

Most don't want to own.

---

Most that do want more house than they can afford...

---

Many Americans are just chasing a decent school system that does not look like a Mad Max movies

The fact that people have to buy $600,000 homes to get their kids in a decent school is part of the brokenness of modern America

---

Hmm. My neighborhood is within a quarter-mile of a good elementary and middle school in a solid school district, with two high schools within 3 miles. Houses in our neighborhood are available for around $300k, and less if you are willing to buy a house from the 1990s in other neighborhoods.

It's nice to build your own home if you can afford to do so, but that shouldn't be the standard for all house prices.

---

I really don't think the average household salary can afford a $300k home right now at an 8% rate with property taxes.

---

I do agree with interest rate hurdle . It really makes a difference. Also, I live basically in Downtown in a high rise where there are a lot of young people and they don't want a house. Even the married ones. As we discussed, they spend their money on experiences and don't want to be tied down to the burbs. Not sure if that is prudent or not, but it is what it is.

---

Yeah lifestyles have drastically change and it may lead to a huge problem down the road. These people aren't going to have home equity or retirement money when they get old. They're also choosing not to have children.

There's also something I call the "status economy" where you have millions of people making stupid financial decisions to keep up with the Jones's. They're barely affording rent while leasing an $80k BMW. We absolutely have an issue with financial ignorance in this country. Tens of millions of people making stupid financial decisions.

---

you are spot on about your second paragraph. Dallas, where I live is the worst offender. We call them $30K Millionaires.

muddybrazos said:

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Redbrickbear said:

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You have to feel for these people… truly.
Inflation is the tax of all taxes… they say inflation has gone down but that’s a lie.
They’ve removed data from inflation collection therefore showing it’s gone down but the overall fundamentals continually go up which is hurting still

— Mickamious (@MickamiousG) March 13, 2024

---

She looks attractive aside from the crying. Go get a husband and have him help you with the bills.

---

how 1950s of you!

Seriously, a room mate or a spouse would be helpful to make younger peoples living situation more affordable.

I know some baylor students that bought a house and rented it to friends/fellow students while going to school at Baylor.

Creative thinking and planning makes things easier for young people