Let me guess... Democrat or Never Trumper? Which is it?DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
As others have pointed out on this thread, that's most likely the DOJ's/Democrat's end game. The question is whether such a penalty is constitutional? Probably not.TexasScientist said:
18 USC Ch. 101: RECORDS AND REPORTS
2071. Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
(a) Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
(b) Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term "office" does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.
SCOTUS has previously ruled that laws cant override the constitution in cases like this related to eligibility of elected official.TexasScientist said:
18 USC Ch. 101: RECORDS AND REPORTS
2071. Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
(a) Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
(b) Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term "office" does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.
supreme Court has previously ruled in multiple cases similar to this. Federal law, does not trump constitutional eligibility requirements. One of the justices in a previous case said the will of people is the will of the people and if they vote for that person and want them to be an elected official, so be it.Mothra said:As others have pointed out on this thread, that's most likely the DOJ's/Democrat's end game. The question is whether such a penalty is constitutional? Probably not.TexasScientist said:
18 USC Ch. 101: RECORDS AND REPORTS
2071. Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
(a) Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
(b) Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term "office" does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.
Mothra said:Let me guess... Democrat or Never Trumper? Which is it?DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
Seriously, what's your take, Dancing Bear who graduated in 09?
Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
you thinking the constitution is radical is what's sad. evil. demented.Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
The sad thing is I've observed radicals like you find out how stupid you were to say these ridiculous things. You will never see it that way though, because you will have moved onto the next conspiracy theory, which will prove all the previous right in your own mind. Sad.
Why'd you bring up Bill Clinton?LateSteak69 said:Oldbear83 said:Like a billionaire who won the White House, then.LateSteak69 said:Oldbear83 said:You post squirmy.LateSteak69 said:Oldbear83 said:Your imagination does not count as a source.LateSteak69 said:Harrison Bergeron said:The Democrats continue at rapid pace to throw out all protocol, policy, and rules to retain power. It's authoritarian.canoso said:Plus, it has been reported this PM that he contributed $2K to Obama's campaign and victory fund in 2008.Redbrickbear said:
The right is far more authoritarian. It's not close.
Right, but facts do. Try to learn about how facts work. Or don't, you're a lost cause so who gives a *****
You post Trumpy.
But no mean tweets from me!
That makes zero sense assuming you aren't a sexual harassing bankrupt failing businessman who bones porn stars then cons sensible Americans to vote for him and ignore all his crappy failures.
Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
The sad thing is I've observed radicals like you find out how stupid you were to say these ridiculous things. You will never see it that way though, because you will have moved onto the next conspiracy theory, which will prove all the previous right in your own mind. Sad.
Hope you're not referring to me. I carry a 2.8 handicap right now.DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
So it's not really about the law. Just politics as usual.whiterock said:most of the outrage about this raid is rooted in the patent double standard at play, about how jarring it is to see how earnestly establishments exercise leniency against individuals in one party while contriving new levels of exactitude against the other.Sam Lowry said:
Anyone going to tell me whether a politician should ever be subject to a search warrant? Or are they above the law?
THAT dynamic is the imminent danger to the Republic. But it serves the vanity of the neverTrumper. Enjoy it while it lasts.
Married A Horn said:you thinking the constitution is radical is what's sad. evil. demented.Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
The sad thing is I've observed radicals like you find out how stupid you were to say these ridiculous things. You will never see it that way though, because you will have moved onto the next conspiracy theory, which will prove all the previous right in your own mind. Sad.
That's not possible. I've been told the law only applies to Trump.Doc Holliday said:Hope you're not referring to me. I carry a 2.8 handicap right now.DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
I'll make a prediction and we'll see if I'm right: The warrant app is going to be leaked to the press saying Trump committed a crime. By the end of this we will learn the application was built on lies just like Carter Page's FISA app which got an FBI agent criminally charged.
Social media posts by the judge who signed off on the Mar-a-Lago warrant.
— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) August 10, 2022
This is beyond improper. It's criminal. pic.twitter.com/jG8NPkEL5O
Good grief this is horrific .riflebear said:Social media posts by the judge who signed off on the Mar-a-Lago warrant.
— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) August 10, 2022
This is beyond improper. It's criminal. pic.twitter.com/jG8NPkEL5O
Clinesmith was reinstated by the D.C. Bar and got a slap on the wrist.Sam Lowry said:That's not possible. I've been told the law only applies to Trump.Doc Holliday said:Hope you're not referring to me. I carry a 2.8 handicap right now.DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
I'll make a prediction and we'll see if I'm right: The warrant app is going to be leaked to the press saying Trump committed a crime. By the end of this we will learn the application was built on lies just like Carter Page's FISA app which got an FBI agent criminally charged.
Fair point, but does it take into account that other presidents, including Obama, kept presidential records and were somehow able to negotiate either keeping them or returning them without a raid on their homes? Does it also take into account what some would call the unnecessary show of force in taking the records from Trump? Did the DOJ really need to send 30 plus heavily armed agents to Trump's home to retrieve them, or is it possible this was a show of force designed for the media (who had apparently been tipped off before the raid began)?Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:you thinking the constitution is radical is what's sad. evil. demented.Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
The sad thing is I've observed radicals like you find out how stupid you were to say these ridiculous things. You will never see it that way though, because you will have moved onto the next conspiracy theory, which will prove all the previous right in your own mind. Sad.
Oh no lady, the Constitution is what Trump and you find wanting. I love America. If a past President ignores repeated requests to return classified documents, and there is a law prohibiting him/her/it retaining them, rule of law dictates that the FBI raid the likely location and retrieve these things that could damage the country.
Rand Paul suggests the FBI may have planted evidence in boxes they seized from Mar-a-Lago pic.twitter.com/3yd6I9tlaa
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) August 10, 2022
HuMcK said:
This sounds like a coordinated message at this point: Trump's lawyer, Eric, and now Rand have all done media hits where they push the "planted evidence" line. Should go without saying, but that's not a good talking point to get boxed into.Rand Paul suggests the FBI may have planted evidence in boxes they seized from Mar-a-Lago pic.twitter.com/3yd6I9tlaa
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) August 10, 2022
It remains to be seen. Page has a $75 million lawsuit pending, and Clinesmith has a felony conviction.Doc Holliday said:Clinesmith was reinstated by the D.C. Bar and got a slap on the wrist.Sam Lowry said:That's not possible. I've been told the law only applies to Trump.Doc Holliday said:Hope you're not referring to me. I carry a 2.8 handicap right now.DancinBear09 said:
You people need to take off your tin foil hats, step away from this forum where you spend more than half of your waking day…get some sunshine, play golf, go fishing, go hunting, do something. It's sad how much this forum is just a echo chamber of the same paranoid, often times, proven wrong folks.
I'll make a prediction and we'll see if I'm right: The warrant app is going to be leaked to the press saying Trump committed a crime. By the end of this we will learn the application was built on lies just like Carter Page's FISA app which got an FBI agent criminally charged.
Carter Page's image and finances were destroyed.
How is that justice?
Another activist. The job they were hired to do comes secondary to the bidding of the democratic party.riflebear said:Social media posts by the judge who signed off on the Mar-a-Lago warrant.
— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) August 10, 2022
This is beyond improper. It's criminal. pic.twitter.com/jG8NPkEL5O
Quote:
The boxes contain documents and mementos from Trump's presidency, reportedly including letters from Barack Obama and Kim Jong Un, and other correspondence with world leaders.
A legal source said that the boxes had been packed up by the General Services Administration and shipped to Mar-a-Lago when Trump left office in January 2020.
Trump's attorneys, led by Evan Corcoran, had been cooperating fully with federal authorities on the return of the documents to the National Archives and Records Administration, according to sources.
In May, Corcoran granted access into Mar-a-Lago's windowless storage room to FBI agents who spent several hours searching through the boxes. Trump stopped by the basement to say hello at one point, says someone who was there.
Quote:
FBI agents scoured Melania Trump's wardrobe and spent several hours combing through Donald Trump's private office, breaking open his safe and rifling through drawers when they raided the former First Family's Mar-a-Lago home in Florida Monday morning.
The Post has learned that the search warrant used by the FBI to enter the palatial Palm Beach property focused solely on presidential records and evidence of classified information being stored there.
Trumps lawyer said she didnt expect anything happened but the way it went down, it could have.. she didnt say they probably didHuMcK said:
This sounds like a coordinated message at this point: Trump's lawyer, Eric, and now Rand have all done media hits where they push the "planted evidence" line. Should go without saying, but that's not a good talking point to get boxed into.Rand Paul suggests the FBI may have planted evidence in boxes they seized from Mar-a-Lago pic.twitter.com/3yd6I9tlaa
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) August 10, 2022
Sam Lowry said:
Trump's enemies tried to hold him responsible for J6 via impeachment, but his allies weren't having it. Y'all won't accept the obvious until the feds connect every little dot. So they're connecting the dots.
Perfectly said. This is akin the the Jan. 6 Stalin Show Trial. One can both be interested in enforcing laws and finding the truth while realizing the particular methods employed are overtly political and egregious violations of polity and history.Mothra said:Fair point, but does it take into account that other presidents, including Obama, kept presidential records and were somehow able to negotiate either keeping them or returning them without a raid on their homes? Does it also take into account what some would call the unnecessary show of force in taking the records from Trump? Did the DOJ really need to send 30 plus heavily armed agents to Trump's home to retrieve them, or is it possible this was a show of force designed for the media (who had apparently been tipped off before the raid began)?Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:you thinking the constitution is radical is what's sad. evil. demented.Porteroso said:Married A Horn said:
After raiding President Trump's home at Mar-a-Lago the Stasi-FBI apprehended Rep. Scott Perry (R-PA) and seized his phone.
Rep. Scott Perry is a staunch Trump supporter.
It is now open season for conservatives and patriotic Americans.
The government has declared war on the American people.
87,000 IRS agents headed your way.
The sad thing is I've observed radicals like you find out how stupid you were to say these ridiculous things. You will never see it that way though, because you will have moved onto the next conspiracy theory, which will prove all the previous right in your own mind. Sad.
Oh no lady, the Constitution is what Trump and you find wanting. I love America. If a past President ignores repeated requests to return classified documents, and there is a law prohibiting him/her/it retaining them, rule of law dictates that the FBI raid the likely location and retrieve these things that could damage the country.
These are the issues that cause people to engage in conspiracy theories, just FYI.
everybody knows its jan 6Sam Lowry said:
Trump's enemies tried to hold him responsible for J6 via impeachment, but his allies weren't having it. Y'all won't accept the obvious until the feds connect every little dot. So they're connecting the dots.
My, my.riflebear said:Social media posts by the judge who signed off on the Mar-a-Lago warrant.
— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) August 10, 2022
This is beyond improper. It's criminal. pic.twitter.com/jG8NPkEL5O
maybe he was right to recuse himself from the other lawsuit and should have done the same here..canoso said:My, my.riflebear said:Social media posts by the judge who signed off on the Mar-a-Lago warrant.
— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) August 10, 2022
This is beyond improper. It's criminal. pic.twitter.com/jG8NPkEL5O
It was letters between him and Kim and a map of Hurricane Dorian that he drew on. The Archives mistakenly gave him the documents, there is no unknowns here. They gave them to Trump and then said they want them back. They were in the Archives, this is not Trump hiding documents or stealing docs. This is a tardy return of something he never took.Stefano DiMera said:
I don't think Hillary shredded or flushed classified documents down her toilet that would put the country in a grave security risk.
The guy that said he could shoot someone in the middle of Manhattan and not lose support certainly wouldn't think he was above the law.
they took 10 boxes of stuff without actually looking for anything specific.. they are now gonna sort thru and see if there is anything "important" thereRMF5630 said:It was letters between him and Kim and a map of Hurricane Dorian that he drew on. The Archives mistakenly gave him the documents, there is no unknowns here. They gave them to Trump and then said they want them back. They were in the Archives, this is not Trump hiding documents or stealing docs. This is a tardy return of something he never took.Stefano DiMera said:
I don't think Hillary shredded or flushed classified documents down her toilet that would put the country in a grave security risk.
The guy that said he could shoot someone in the middle of Manhattan and not lose support certainly wouldn't think he was above the law.
A Federal warrant? 30 FBI agents??? To get a couple of letters and a map of a hurricane????? That doesn't seem a bit over the top to you?
4th and Inches said:they took 10 boxes of stuff without actually looking for anything specific.. they are now gonna sort thru and see if there is anything "important" thereRMF5630 said:It was letters between him and Kim and a map of Hurricane Dorian that he drew on. The Archives mistakenly gave him the documents, there is no unknowns here. They gave them to Trump and then said they want them back. They were in the Archives, this is not Trump hiding documents or stealing docs. This is a tardy return of something he never took.Stefano DiMera said:
I don't think Hillary shredded or flushed classified documents down her toilet that would put the country in a grave security risk.
The guy that said he could shoot someone in the middle of Manhattan and not lose support certainly wouldn't think he was above the law.
A Federal warrant? 30 FBI agents??? To get a couple of letters and a map of a hurricane????? That doesn't seem a bit over the top to you?
It is my party, and yes, I was extremely concerned when they lied and spied on him. It was the main thing I posted about from the time he took office through the first impeachment. What concerns me now is that, because Trump won an election and was treated unfairly, his supporters think he has license to tear the country apart when he loses. He's lied non-stop since 2020 with absolutely no concern for how divisive and destructive it was, even to the point of causing violence (whether intentionally or not). He shows no sign of remorse. Sure he was mistreated at times, but he's used up all sympathy at this point.riflebear said:Sam Lowry said:
Trump's enemies tried to hold him responsible for J6 via impeachment, but his allies weren't having it. Y'all won't accept the obvious until the feds connect every little dot. So they're connecting the dots.
Were u this concerned with connecting the dots when they spied on (and lied repeatedly) and tried to take down a sitting President when he started his term?
Again, I want him out of the Presidency but he's been treated worse than any POTUS I can remember and it's all happening from the inside with a coordinated attack from day 1 including the media which is frightening. But since it's not your party I guess it's all good, right? Whatever it takes?
right, just telling you what they did..RMF5630 said:4th and Inches said:they took 10 boxes of stuff without actually looking for anything specific.. they are now gonna sort thru and see if there is anything "important" thereRMF5630 said:It was letters between him and Kim and a map of Hurricane Dorian that he drew on. The Archives mistakenly gave him the documents, there is no unknowns here. They gave them to Trump and then said they want them back. They were in the Archives, this is not Trump hiding documents or stealing docs. This is a tardy return of something he never took.Stefano DiMera said:
I don't think Hillary shredded or flushed classified documents down her toilet that would put the country in a grave security risk.
The guy that said he could shoot someone in the middle of Manhattan and not lose support certainly wouldn't think he was above the law.
A Federal warrant? 30 FBI agents??? To get a couple of letters and a map of a hurricane????? That doesn't seem a bit over the top to you?
[url=http://www.cnn.com/][/url]
[url=http://www.cnn.com/][/url]CNN
[url=http://www.cnn.com/][/url]
Timeline: The Justice Department criminal inquiry into Trump taking classified documents to Mar-a-Lago
May 2021
An official from NARA contacts Trump's team after realizing that several important documents weren't handed over before Trump left the White House. In hopes of locating the missing items, NARA lawyer Gary Stern reaches out to someone who served in the White House counsel's office under Trump, who was the point of contact for recordkeeping matters. The missing documents include some of Trump's correspondence with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un, as well as the map of Hurricane Dorian that Trump infamously altered with a sharpie pen.
