War with Iran?

134,889 Views | 2180 Replies | Last: 4 mo ago by whiterock
The_barBEARian
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

Rod Dreher- [So, it's on between Israel and Iran. Things are moving so fast that by the time I send this dispatch, God only knows what else will have happened. The things to keep in mind are these:

  • Iran, a country ruled by Islamist fanatics, has long signaled its intention to destroy Israel. Not to live in peace with Israel, but to destroy it.
  • It has shown its willingness to do so by subsidizing the Hezbollah terrorist army in Lebanon. Israel destroyed that terror proxy.
  • Iran has also openly supported Hamas, financially and otherwise, since the 1990s, as part of its regional war against Israel. The October 7 massacre showed Iran's willingness to sponsor a 9/11-style mass terror attack on Israeli citizens.
  • Israel judged correctly in my view that Iran's acquiring a nuclear weapon would be an existential threat to itself. Yesterday the IAEA said that Iran has not been living up to its commitments to curb its nuclear research meaning that the Tehran government's word cannot be trusted.
I wish it had not come to this. I went to bed last night praying that it wouldn't. It was always going to come to this, though, as long as Iran is ruled by the Islamists. The threat a nuclear-armed Iran would have posed to Israel was and is undeniable. Expecting the Israelis, or any other nation so targeted by Iran, to remain idle and hope for the best was totally unrealistic. Given that the Iranian government has for many years been openly stating that its goal is to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, there is only one obvious reason for Iran to get a nuclear weapon.

I hope the Israelis succeeded in their mission goal. The Natanz nuclear enrichment site appears to have been destroyed. The Israelis wiped out the entire senior leadership of the Islamic Republic, save for Ayatollah Khamenei. Iran reports the deaths of at least six of its nuclear scientists; there are probably more.
The retaliation against Israel by Iran will be severe. Happily, now that Hezbollah and Hamas have been deactivated by the IDF, Israel will have less to worry about. But there will be massive drone strikes against Israeli cities. If you fear a regional war, then you should be aware that there is no chance that Arab states will come in on Iran's side. The Iranians are not Arabs, and they are Shia; the Arab states have long been afraid of Iran's regional hegemony. Whatever they say for public consumption, you can be sure that there is great relief in the governments of the Gulf Arab states today.

There will be Iranian-sponsored attacks on US interests in the Middle East. What we have to hope for is that the Iranians won't be foolish enough to provoke Washington to come into the war on Israel's side. In my view, Trump will only involve the US in this conflict if the Iranians attack American interests, either directly or via terrorist proxy. If Tehran does provoke Washington in this way, then the US military will be end the Islamist regime in Iran. I hope and pray it does not come to that we do not need to be involved in another Mideast war! but if Iran attacks us, we will have no choice.]


Two points...

1) the head of the IAEA is an Israeli asset... so that entire organization is as compromised as our Federal Government.

2) The US military has already entered into this conflict and shot down some of the Iranian drones.

The one part I am actually looking forward to in all this is that the cowardly, corrupt Gulf Arabs are all next for Israeli expansion ALL of Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria are within the territorial ambitions of Greater Israel along with portions of Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Iraq.
I bet the contortions you go through to explain Israel exchanging land for peace are really something to see

That was before your hero Satanyahu took over
The_barBEARian
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LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LIB,MR BEARS said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

Rod Dreher- [So, it's on between Israel and Iran. Things are moving so fast that by the time I send this dispatch, God only knows what else will have happened. The things to keep in mind are these:

  • Iran, a country ruled by Islamist fanatics, has long signaled its intention to destroy Israel. Not to live in peace with Israel, but to destroy it.
  • It has shown its willingness to do so by subsidizing the Hezbollah terrorist army in Lebanon. Israel destroyed that terror proxy.
  • Iran has also openly supported Hamas, financially and otherwise, since the 1990s, as part of its regional war against Israel. The October 7 massacre showed Iran's willingness to sponsor a 9/11-style mass terror attack on Israeli citizens.
  • Israel judged correctly in my view that Iran's acquiring a nuclear weapon would be an existential threat to itself. Yesterday the IAEA said that Iran has not been living up to its commitments to curb its nuclear research meaning that the Tehran government's word cannot be trusted.
I wish it had not come to this. I went to bed last night praying that it wouldn't. It was always going to come to this, though, as long as Iran is ruled by the Islamists. The threat a nuclear-armed Iran would have posed to Israel was and is undeniable. Expecting the Israelis, or any other nation so targeted by Iran, to remain idle and hope for the best was totally unrealistic. Given that the Iranian government has for many years been openly stating that its goal is to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, there is only one obvious reason for Iran to get a nuclear weapon.

I hope the Israelis succeeded in their mission goal. The Natanz nuclear enrichment site appears to have been destroyed. The Israelis wiped out the entire senior leadership of the Islamic Republic, save for Ayatollah Khamenei. Iran reports the deaths of at least six of its nuclear scientists; there are probably more.
The retaliation against Israel by Iran will be severe. Happily, now that Hezbollah and Hamas have been deactivated by the IDF, Israel will have less to worry about. But there will be massive drone strikes against Israeli cities. If you fear a regional war, then you should be aware that there is no chance that Arab states will come in on Iran's side. The Iranians are not Arabs, and they are Shia; the Arab states have long been afraid of Iran's regional hegemony. Whatever they say for public consumption, you can be sure that there is great relief in the governments of the Gulf Arab states today.

There will be Iranian-sponsored attacks on US interests in the Middle East. What we have to hope for is that the Iranians won't be foolish enough to provoke Washington to come into the war on Israel's side. In my view, Trump will only involve the US in this conflict if the Iranians attack American interests, either directly or via terrorist proxy. If Tehran does provoke Washington in this way, then the US military will be end the Islamist regime in Iran. I hope and pray it does not come to that we do not need to be involved in another Mideast war! but if Iran attacks us, we will have no choice.]


Two points...



The one part I am actually looking forward to in all this is that the cowardly, corrupt Gulf Arabs are all next for Israeli expansion ALL of Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria are within the territorial ambitions of Greater Israel along with portions of Egypt, Saudi Arabia, and Iraq.


Amusing

Might as well claim Israel has intentions towards annexing Los Angeles.

Careful, Captain Dachau thinks the Jews already own Hollywood.

White people = evil.

Jews = good.
Porteroso
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The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride

I bet that statistic is misleading. Americans generally support free nations, and civilians being able go live their lives.
The_barBEARian
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Porteroso said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride

I bet that statistic is misleading. Americans generally support free nations, and civilians being able go live their lives.

Americans generally dont support fanatical nations who start world wars.
Redbrickbear
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The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle

The_barBEARian
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Just remember... some of you said we were holding Israel back. Well now they woke the Dragon... FAFO I guess.
The_barBEARian
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The_barBEARian
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The_barBEARian
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The_barBEARian
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LIB,MR BEARS
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Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.
OsoCoreyell
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The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle




You're a nut
KaiBear
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OsoCoreyell said:

The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle




You're a nut


I don't believe so.

Though he clearly is a classic Jew hater.

Millions just like him.

However I do agree with his premise that our government officials have received far too much money from Israeli lobbyists over the years.

Both Republicans and Democrats are guilty of accepting the cash. They have become addicted to it.

Mitch Blood Green
How long do you want to ignore this user?
OsoCoreyell said:

The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle




You're a nut


He may be a nut but the question is valid. Is Isreal a good ally?

I am not a fan of Trump. The fact that they have, again, forced the hand of an American president to do their will is unconscionable.

We don't get to dictate how they handle foreign policy. We do get to decide if we will be complicit.
Mothra
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle




The fact you label Russia as the country that should be our best ally says all one needs to know about you. Anyone who would suggest a bloodthirsty dictator responsible for squelching freedom and persecuting Christian's should be our best ally is not a serious thinker.
Mothra
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.
Mothra
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mitch Blood Green said:

OsoCoreyell said:

The_barBEARian said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

The best ally we could use over there against Islamic terrorism is Russia. They've had a history of dealing with jihadis like we have in the West. But the Jews HATE the Russians almost as much as they HATE Western Europeans, so instead we have to celebrate killing white Christians (Russians) who in any sane world would be natural allies.

I guess my question back to you is name one time Israel has been a good ally?

They fed us false intel after 9/11 then sat back and didnt raise a finger in Iraq or Afghanistan as we completely destabilized the Middle East and caused the biggest human migration of refugees in modern history from the Middle East into Europe.

They never sent troops to Vietnam... I guess they too busy killing our servicemen and committing false flag attacks against us.

And finally the piece de resistance - Mossad's Epstein honeypot pedo ring used to blackmail Clinton, Trump, and god knows how many other American political and military leaders. Destroying the evidence while it was in FBI custody was like spitting in our faces and then rubbing it in our eyes.

P.S. This meme made me chuckle




You're a nut


He may be a nut but the question is valid. Is Isreal a good ally?

I am not a fan of Trump. The fact that they have, again, forced the hand of an American president to do their will is unconscionable.

We don't get to dictate how they handle foreign policy. We do get to decide if we will be complicit.


Israel has long provided military support, intelligence and a launching pad for U.S. forces.
Mothra
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Sam Lowry said:

Mothra said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

Rod Dreher- [So, it's on between Israel and Iran. Things are moving so fast that by the time I send this dispatch, God only knows what else will have happened. The things to keep in mind are these:

  • Iran, a country ruled by Islamist fanatics, has long signaled its intention to destroy Israel. Not to live in peace with Israel, but to destroy it.
  • It has shown its willingness to do so by subsidizing the Hezbollah terrorist army in Lebanon. Israel destroyed that terror proxy.
  • Iran has also openly supported Hamas, financially and otherwise, since the 1990s, as part of its regional war against Israel. The October 7 massacre showed Iran's willingness to sponsor a 9/11-style mass terror attack on Israeli citizens.
  • Israel judged correctly in my view that Iran's acquiring a nuclear weapon would be an existential threat to itself. Yesterday the IAEA said that Iran has not been living up to its commitments to curb its nuclear research meaning that the Tehran government's word cannot be trusted.
I wish it had not come to this. I went to bed last night praying that it wouldn't. It was always going to come to this, though, as long as Iran is ruled by the Islamists. The threat a nuclear-armed Iran would have posed to Israel was and is undeniable. Expecting the Israelis, or any other nation so targeted by Iran, to remain idle and hope for the best was totally unrealistic. Given that the Iranian government has for many years been openly stating that its goal is to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, there is only one obvious reason for Iran to get a nuclear weapon.

I hope the Israelis succeeded in their mission goal. The Natanz nuclear enrichment site appears to have been destroyed. The Israelis wiped out the entire senior leadership of the Islamic Republic, save for Ayatollah Khamenei. Iran reports the deaths of at least six of its nuclear scientists; there are probably more.
The retaliation against Israel by Iran will be severe. Happily, now that Hezbollah and Hamas have been deactivated by the IDF, Israel will have less to worry about. But there will be massive drone strikes against Israeli cities. If you fear a regional war, then you should be aware that there is no chance that Arab states will come in on Iran's side. The Iranians are not Arabs, and they are Shia; the Arab states have long been afraid of Iran's regional hegemony. Whatever they say for public consumption, you can be sure that there is great relief in the governments of the Gulf Arab states today.

There will be Iranian-sponsored attacks on US interests in the Middle East. What we have to hope for is that the Iranians won't be foolish enough to provoke Washington to come into the war on Israel's side. In my view, Trump will only involve the US in this conflict if the Iranians attack American interests, either directly or via terrorist proxy. If Tehran does provoke Washington in this way, then the US military will be end the Islamist regime in Iran. I hope and pray it does not come to that we do not need to be involved in another Mideast war! but if Iran attacks us, we will have no choice.]
Yikes...I had no idea Rod was so uninformed. It's bizarre seeing his journey from Iraq war cheerleader to "severely chastened" critic to apparently getting fooled all over again.

Lesson unlearned, I guess.


Not sure that an individual who's been right on foreign policy matters less than Biden should be casting stones. I mean, you pretty much suck at this.

I don't agree with Rod on everything, but at least he doesn't spew Russian propaganda.
If I say Russia will win in Ukraine, and Russia ends up winning, is it still Russian propaganda?


No more than when I say it. Did you really believe that is what I was referring to?
Mothra
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Sam Lowry said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Sam Lowry said:

Mothra said:

Realitybites said:

Iran launches more than 100 drones at Israel in retaliation for striking nuclear sites: IDF

https://nypost.com/2025/06/13/world-news/iran-launches-more-than-100-drones-in-retaliation-after-israel-targets-nuclear-sites/

"Drones have yet to cross into Israeli territory, the IDF confirmed."

i wonder how many of the 8 million illegal aliens Biden added to 30+ million already here are sympaticos of the IRGC.

"Iran is about to have a nuke" is something we have been hearing for a decade and a half now. McAmnesty was running with this line for years. Given that, the odds are that they either already have several or they did not intend to develop one.

With Russia winning in Ukraine you have to wonder how much of this has to do with the need to develop another profit center for the MI complez and Netanhayu's political fortunes.

"About to have a nuke" is probably a more effective marketing tool than "Putin is Hitler" or "safe and effective."
That's not what the IAEA says. Enrichment is a difficult and time consuming process. I suspect it's very likely that they don't have nukes but are on the verge.

The idea they don't want to develop a nuke is, quite simply, preposterous. Of course they do. It will change the balance of power in the ME if they get one.
We've been told they were on the verge for 40 years.

How many times and over how many years have the Israelis hit Iranian nuclear facilities?
Zero. They've done some cyber-attacks, assassinations, and minor sabotage, but never anything like this. So both of these claims can't be true. If Iran was ever that close, and if they really wanted nukes, they would have them by now.


Is it really your position that Iran doesn't want nukes?
sombear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally.

KaiBear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.
Agreed

Important for every Christian to comprehend this.
LIB,MR BEARS
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.
He also forgets that Gentiles (Roman's) drove the nails , made the crown of thorns, performed the beating and released Barabas.

Clowns gotta clown
Sam Lowry
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mothra said:

Sam Lowry said:

Mothra said:

Sam Lowry said:

Redbrickbear said:

Rod Dreher- [So, it's on between Israel and Iran. Things are moving so fast that by the time I send this dispatch, God only knows what else will have happened. The things to keep in mind are these:

  • Iran, a country ruled by Islamist fanatics, has long signaled its intention to destroy Israel. Not to live in peace with Israel, but to destroy it.
  • It has shown its willingness to do so by subsidizing the Hezbollah terrorist army in Lebanon. Israel destroyed that terror proxy.
  • Iran has also openly supported Hamas, financially and otherwise, since the 1990s, as part of its regional war against Israel. The October 7 massacre showed Iran's willingness to sponsor a 9/11-style mass terror attack on Israeli citizens.
  • Israel judged correctly in my view that Iran's acquiring a nuclear weapon would be an existential threat to itself. Yesterday the IAEA said that Iran has not been living up to its commitments to curb its nuclear research meaning that the Tehran government's word cannot be trusted.
I wish it had not come to this. I went to bed last night praying that it wouldn't. It was always going to come to this, though, as long as Iran is ruled by the Islamists. The threat a nuclear-armed Iran would have posed to Israel was and is undeniable. Expecting the Israelis, or any other nation so targeted by Iran, to remain idle and hope for the best was totally unrealistic. Given that the Iranian government has for many years been openly stating that its goal is to wipe Israel off the face of the earth, there is only one obvious reason for Iran to get a nuclear weapon.

I hope the Israelis succeeded in their mission goal. The Natanz nuclear enrichment site appears to have been destroyed. The Israelis wiped out the entire senior leadership of the Islamic Republic, save for Ayatollah Khamenei. Iran reports the deaths of at least six of its nuclear scientists; there are probably more.
The retaliation against Israel by Iran will be severe. Happily, now that Hezbollah and Hamas have been deactivated by the IDF, Israel will have less to worry about. But there will be massive drone strikes against Israeli cities. If you fear a regional war, then you should be aware that there is no chance that Arab states will come in on Iran's side. The Iranians are not Arabs, and they are Shia; the Arab states have long been afraid of Iran's regional hegemony. Whatever they say for public consumption, you can be sure that there is great relief in the governments of the Gulf Arab states today.

There will be Iranian-sponsored attacks on US interests in the Middle East. What we have to hope for is that the Iranians won't be foolish enough to provoke Washington to come into the war on Israel's side. In my view, Trump will only involve the US in this conflict if the Iranians attack American interests, either directly or via terrorist proxy. If Tehran does provoke Washington in this way, then the US military will be end the Islamist regime in Iran. I hope and pray it does not come to that we do not need to be involved in another Mideast war! but if Iran attacks us, we will have no choice.]
Yikes...I had no idea Rod was so uninformed. It's bizarre seeing his journey from Iraq war cheerleader to "severely chastened" critic to apparently getting fooled all over again.

Lesson unlearned, I guess.


Not sure that an individual who's been right on foreign policy matters less than Biden should be casting stones. I mean, you pretty much suck at this.

I don't agree with Rod on everything, but at least he doesn't spew Russian propaganda.
If I say Russia will win in Ukraine, and Russia ends up winning, is it still Russian propaganda?


No more than when I say it. Did you really believe that is what I was referring to?
How should I know? I could post that the sky is blue, and Chat8084 would be there in 30 seconds to say it was Russian propaganda.

I am curious where you think I've been wrong on foreign policy. Among other things I've predicted:

-No WMD in Iraq
-No WMD in Iran
-Taliban wins in Afghanistan
-Ukraine counter-offensive fails

Always got called "un-American," always got proven right.
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.


It's funny how you guys can't challenge the current topic - why is Israel a good ally?

So instead you go off on a strawman about something I don't recall saying in an attempt to smear the messenger to avoid hearing the message.

LIB,MR BEARS
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.


It's funny how you guys can't challenge the current topic - why is Israel a good ally?

So instead you go off on a strawman about something I don't recall saying in an attempt to smear the messenger to avoid hearing the message.



It's funny how you seem to not recall Sombear's post describing why Israel is a good ally.

So you don't struggle in finding it. Here it is again:

" There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally."
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
sombear said:

There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally.




I imagine a lot of those posters have benefitted quite a bit financially from our parasitic relationship with Israel so I'm not sure their testimony would be all that helpful. There is a very thin line between former military and defense contractor. The Military Industrial Complex is pretty incestuous like that.

Yes, I understand we completely cover the bill on all military development, hence why our defense budget is about to hit $1 trillion annual despite the fact they can't pass an audit showing where all the money goes, and after we pay 100% of the cost, Israel gets to use these systems and sell them to the Chinese for a profit.... how does this benefit American tax payers though?

***Edit*** Forgot to add that we co-development military projects with countries like the UK and Australia and they pay their fair share... so why cant Israel when I am told they are the real world Wakanda by all the Boomers?

Israeli intel is second to none? I guess that explains why Satanyahu thought 9/11 said was the greatest day in Israeli history.

The one time we needed intel from Israel they lied to us and got us into the Iraq War! Israel is so helpful!

We support Israel because of the cold war.... the cold war ended 30 years ago and ohh btw, they were killing American servicemen during the cold war.

Why doesnt Israel fight in our battles? Well nothing sinister... we exist to serve Israel. Their safety and priorities will always come before America and that is why we are required to fight their wars.... brilliant response!

Israel has always taken the position it fights only in self-defense.... well we can take that off the table after the last 48 hrs. This no longer applies.

Breaking news! Spying, stealing, and lying are usually not great qualities to look for when choosing allies..... do you let your wife go through all your work emails while shes sleeping with your best friend too?

Israel is a terrible ally and nothing you said says otherwise.
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.


It's funny how you guys can't challenge the current topic - why is Israel a good ally?

So instead you go off on a strawman about something I don't recall saying in an attempt to smear the messenger to avoid hearing the message.



It's funny how you seem to not recall Sombear's post describing why Israel is a good ally.

So you don't struggle in finding it. Here it is again:

" There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally."


Just responded to it.

Critical thinking takes a little time... something most of you aren't familiar with.
Redbrickbear
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Porteroso said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride

I bet that statistic is misleading. Americans generally support free nations, and civilians being able go live their lives.


I think is very obvious most Americans support Israel over Iran in any conflict

But that goes with the important caveat that Americans don't want their sons in anymore direct wars in the Middle East


EatMoreSalmon
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.


It's funny how you guys can't challenge the current topic - why is Israel a good ally?

So instead you go off on a strawman about something I don't recall saying in an attempt to smear the messenger to avoid hearing the message.



It's funny how you seem to not recall Sombear's post describing why Israel is a good ally.

So you don't struggle in finding it. Here it is again:

" There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally."


Just responded to it.

Critical thinking takes a little time... something most of you aren't familiar with.




May God have mercy upon your mind and heart.
The_barBEARian
How long do you want to ignore this user?
EatMoreSalmon said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

Mothra said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

Redbrickbear said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride


I am absolutely with you on the idea that Israel is not always a great ally.

(I belly ache a lot about us giving them billions)

But I really do feel you are over playing the idea that they are some kind of enemy.

Or that we could have any real friends in the region at all…. I mean is Saudi Arabia (9/11, Wahabbi Islamism) or Turkey (neo-ottoman imperialism), or Iran (shi'ite Islamism), or all the other dysfunctional states over there supposed to be better potential allies?

We have to work with who is over there no?

And Israel has not proven to be any sort of long term foe of America or our interests in the region

"But, they killed Jesus". and no, that's not a sarcastic response. That is an actual argument barBEARian has made before.


A common refrain of Jew haters. It's because they're not actually Christian. Any Christian understands that god preordained his death at the hands of the Jews to save humanity.


It's funny how you guys can't challenge the current topic - why is Israel a good ally?

So instead you go off on a strawman about something I don't recall saying in an attempt to smear the messenger to avoid hearing the message.



It's funny how you seem to not recall Sombear's post describing why Israel is a good ally.

So you don't struggle in finding it. Here it is again:

" There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally."


Just responded to it.

Critical thinking takes a little time... something most of you aren't familiar with.




May God have mercy upon your mind and heart.

Well that's kind of you.

Most of these Boomers want me to die for criticizing Israel.
The_barBEARian
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Redbrickbear said:

Porteroso said:

The_barBEARian said:

LIB,MR BEARS said:

The_barBEARian said:

KaiBear said:

The_barBEARian said:

ATL Bear said:

KaiBear said:

muddybrazos said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Harrison Bergeron said:

Mitch Blood Green said:

Sadly, we are here because of Trump. He threw out the first nuclear deal that Iran negotiated in good faith.

Iran came back to the table to negotiate a new deal with Trump. In good faith.

I believe Trump sees Bibi for what he is. But he's unable to rein him in. I do t see why Iran stays at the table.
Why do you want Iran to have a nuke? Oh yeah, "from the river to the sea."


I don't want them to have a nuke. We had a deal that allowed them to have nuclear energy but not a bomb.

Isreal and Trump killed that deal. I don't want Isreal to have a nuke, either. They have shown themselves to be an irresponsible neighbor.
JFK agreed with you and it got him shot in the head.


There is zero evidence Israel had anything to do with Kennedy's assassination.

The mafia, CiA and Castro are the legitimate suspects.
Some of these dudes are straight anti-Semite bomb throwers. You have to be really hard up to be an Iranian sympathizer.


Don't check any Millennials or Gen Z opinion polls towards Israel or your Gen X heart might give out.


There is some truth to this.

Hopefully Israel can secure a lasting peace asap.

Because as we old folks die off US support is going to weaken dramatically.




I think they'll be fine.

They literally spent my entire life buying off and playing Boomers into giving over their children and grandchildren's inheritance to them.

They already bankrupted the country for Israel. By the time Millennials or Gen Z have any power there won't be anything left to steal.


It's telling that nearly every complaint you have of Israel deals with money (taxes, fuel cost, debt)

You forgot stealing military secrets and selling them to the Chinese, murdering US Servicemen, using the Israel lobby to subvert democracy and the will of the American people.

Support for Israel from the American public is about 35-40% but congress gives them 100% support. You can usually count on one hand the members of Congress who stand up to Israel bcs the Israel lobby pumps hundreds of millions in Congressional races to remove anyone who mentions ending the free ride

I bet that statistic is misleading. Americans generally support free nations, and civilians being able go live their lives.


I think is very obvious most Americans support Israel over Iran in any conflict

But that goes with the important caveat that Americans don't want their sons in anymore direct wars in the Middle East




It is so obvious Red?

I think a lot of Americans, especially younger Americans, share my view that we dont support either and hope they both lose.
sombear
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The_barBEARian said:

sombear said:

There are SE365 posters who could share great detail on our military relationship with Israel although most of it would be classified.

But suffice to say, we work more closely with them and rely on them far more than most ever know.

We use Israeli weapons and equipment.

We jointly develop weapons and equipment.

We share intel, and Israeli intel is second to none.

And for those who think this all is some kind of conspiracy, almost all of this goes back to the cold war. Russia supported the Arab countries. Our direct support of Israel was deliberated over many years.

As for why Israel doesn't send soldiers to fight along U.S. soldiers? Again, nothing sinister. Mostly, we do not want them directly fighting by our side. We risk losing what little Arab support we typically have. Reason 2, because Israel is surrounded by countries who want to destroy it, Israel has always taken the position that it fights only in defense. All of this could change in the future as we (and Israel) cultivate better relationships with the Arab countries.

Spying? Breaking news . . . friends have always spied on each other.

Israel is a tremendous ally.




I imagine a lot of those posters have benefitted quite a bit financially from our parasitic relationship with Israel so I'm not sure their testimony would be all that helpful. There is a very thin line between former military and defense contractor. The Military Industrial Complex is pretty incestuous like that.

Yes, I understand we completely cover the bill on all military development, hence why our defense budget is about to hit $1 trillion annual despite the fact they can't pass an audit showing where all the money goes, and after we pay 100% of the cost, Israel gets to use these systems and sell them to the Chinese for a profit.... how does this benefit American tax payers though?

***Edit*** Forgot to add that we co-development military projects with countries like the UK and Australia and they pay their fair share... so why cant Israel when I am told they are the real world Wakanda by all the Boomers?

Israeli intel is second to none? I guess that explains why Satanyahu thought 9/11 said was the greatest day in Israeli history.

The one time we needed intel from Israel they lied to us and got us into the Iraq War! Israel is so helpful!

We support Israel because of the cold war.... the cold war ended 30 years ago and ohh btw, they were killing American servicemen during the cold war.

Why doesnt Israel fight in our battles? Well nothing sinister... we exist to serve Israel. Their safety and priorities will always come before America and that is why we are required to fight their wars.... brilliant response!

Israel has always taken the position it fights only in self-defense.... well we can take that off the table after the last 48 hrs. This no longer applies.

Breaking news! Spying, stealing, and lying are usually not great qualities to look for when choosing allies..... do you let your wife go through all your work emails while shes sleeping with your best friend too?

Israel is a terrible ally and nothing you said says otherwise.



Israel pays hundreds of billions for U.S. weapons.

No, Israel pays its share for joint development.

On the Cold War, there are all kinds of crazy conspiracies on why we started supporting Israel. But it's actually very simple. That was my point.

Again, allies spy on allies.

Virtually every country in the world thought Iraq had WMDs. Hussein's own generals thought they had them.

Israel has directly helped us prevent numerous terrorist attacks.

Israel has helped us immensely with.anti-hacking and other tech warfare programs.

We still decline Israel troop support, and Israel still fights in defense.
 
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