ATL Bear said:

---

At some point it isn't about the number of missiles you have, but the facilities and vehicles required to fire them from. With air superiority, satellite and aerial intel for Israel, it becomes a declining equation for Iran. Their only option is mass launch at this point as I'd gather that capacity will continue to dwindle. An ounce of prevention at origin is worth a pound of interception at destination.

---

It also depletes their stockpile, limits their funding and ties up their ability to help Hamas and Hezbollah.

Jack Bauer said:

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Jack Bauer said:

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Probably the most insane video you'll see today.

An Iranian news station got nailed while live on air. pic.twitter.com/XJiUWKdCj0

— Townhall.com (@townhallcom) June 16, 2025

---

"We have to take a short break for technical difficulties..."

---

Post of the Month

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Yep.

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Its about both, and I don't think Israel has made any secret about that interest. Iran hasn't made their regime change interests for Israel a secret either.

EDIT: Except Trump apparently held Israel back from actually completing it.

Iran's state TV showed this photo of burning Israel.

Thank you for acknowledging that Judea and Samaria ("West Bank") are an integral part of Israel. pic.twitter.com/ZouhSG92KF

— Dr. Eli David (@DrEliDavid) June 16, 2025

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Israel stayed out of Desert Storm 1, not to mention there was no regime change from Desert Storm. Sadaam stayed in power 13 years longer because the coalition mission was throwing Iraq out of Kuwait. But, don't let the facts get in the way of a good rant.

ATL Bear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Its about both, and I don't think Israel has made any secret about that interest. Iran hasn't made their regime change interests for Israel a secret either.

EDIT: Except Trump apparently held Israel back from actually completing it.

---

Killing Khamenei and his son still wouldn't have ended the regime. It would have only made them martyrs.

You America Last guys never learn.

Iranian society was slowly changing and abandoning Islamism as evidence by the current moderate President being elected over the more hardline opponent in their last election.

Now I would expect a lot of the moderates in Iran to join the hardliners bcs Israel just showed them how wrong they were to trust the West.

whiterock said:

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The_barBEARian said:

---

This is getting out of hand!
TRUMP END THIS WAR NOW! https://t.co/iCVwthTUGV

— Luke Rudkowski (@Lukewearechange) June 16, 2025

We couldn't get our tax cuts extended.... but Israel got America to fight its war.... we are way past due for another civil war...

---

Uh….no.

We have tankers already in theater, because we already have bombers in theater. i.e. the Iranian know that bombers in Diego Garcia are no threat to them unless we have tankers in place to assist the air assets. Even more true for naval air ops.

We have a large joint exercise upcoming in Finland. That is more likely where these tankers are going. (To demonstrate power during ongoing negotiations with Russia over Ukraine).

Why do we have all this stuff in place? No, it's not to start a ground war in Europe or Middle East. It's to demonstrate power during on going diplomatic negotiations with Russia and Iran.

It's gunboat diplomacy. The diplomats are most effective when their interlocutors are staring down the barrel of a gun.

---

and, if Iran is stupid enough to hit Americans hard enough to invoke a response, you don't want to have delays in ramping up for an extended bombardment.

ron.reagan said:

---

nein51 said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

whiterock said:

---

Redbrickbear said:

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Putin called Trump, who informed him that America would not restrain Israel. Putin called Khamenei and basically told him “yeah I’d start thinking about taking that deal now” lmao pic.twitter.com/0TpUJ6Zoea

— Patrick Casey (@restoreorderusa) June 15, 2025

---

As I've said many times, we get more bang for our buck with Israel than any other relationship. They take out a nuclear threat, without us having to engage Iran directly.

FYI we arrived in Italy last week to visit our daughter thru this coming weekend. Logistics officers do know how to plan and she laid out a fun week for us. But we've had to chunk that and are headed back to base right now. Night shifts moving 3x volumes of stuff….

Reading available OSINT seems clear USAF and USNavy are helping directly and indirectly (i.e. supporting regional allies) to engage incoming fires over Israel. Also seeing reports that Iranian regime officials are sending family to Russia.

Iranian regime is at risk of collapse.
US defense contractors selling lots of ordnance.

Thank you, Israel. They're doing all the front-line heavy lifting making a big percentage of the world, including us specifically, a safer place

---

The average ballistic missile costs $300,000.

The average Arrow missile cost $3,000,000.

Everytime Israel starts a new war, the cost to the American tax payers is astronomical.

Israel is the worst investment America has ever made.... hence why America has never made a profit supporting Israel... just added a whole lot more debt.

You Boomers really just dont give a single **** about the future of this country and have no problem loading up the debt fighting other country's wars.

---

What the education system did to our younger generations is criminal.

---

There is a definite lack of understanding of history.

---

I just don't understand why the US keeps naming all of our weapons Jewish names

---

Nobody is scared of cannolis

KaiBear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Sometimes it pays to read opposition press

Closure of Strait of Hormuz seriously being reviewed by Iran, lawmaker says
https://english.alarabiya.net/News/middle-east/2025/06/14/closure-of-strait-of-hormuz-seriously-being-reviewed-by-iran-lawmaker-says

What is the Strait of Hormuz, could it factor into Israel-Iran conflict?
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/6/14/what-is-the-strait-of-hormuz-could-it-factor-into-israel-iran-conflict

Hopefully Trump has the guts to resist the Israeli push to war, but I'm starting to doubt it. From defunding Ukraine to deporting illegals he seems to be taking several steps backwards recently.

Whiterock and his CIA/MI complex buddies may just get the third world war they are lobbying for.

---

Doubt the Russians get directly involved......they already have their hands full.

China's economy needs the US far more than Iran.

Right now.....doubt WW3 is likely regardless if the US gets involved or not.

---

Correct. In addition……

1) Closure of Hormuz hurts China as much as anyone else. They probably cut Iran off.
2) closure of Hormuz brings in the rest of the Gulf states and Nato to reopen it. (I.E. more incoming arty and air forces making craters in Iran.).
3) we've sunk the entire Iranian Navy before and can easily do so again. In minutes.
4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.
5) (I could go on for quite a while…..)

Iran is not a serious power for anything other than playing disrupter to status quo. It has suffered total loss of its two largest and most capable proxies, and its third has been degraded to level of annoyance. Its antique AF is gone. Russia cannot afford to help it and will more likely seek to leverage the Iranian plight to its benefit in Ukraine negotiations. And China will do nothing more than loan them money to buy stuff to stay in the fight (just to bleed western arsenals).

Trump is playing this beautifully. Standing back and letting Israel do the dirty work while making ambiguous public statements that keep distance and options open, and quietly helping Israel enough to keep up the pressure. The only pathway the mullahs have for peaceful resolution is to let the international community haul out all the remaining nuclear stuff.

Life expectancy for Iranian nuclear scientists at this time is weeks/months. Mosssd will get them all before we hang our Christmas ornaments.

The only thing we should be upset about is that it took us decades too long to get to this point.

NoKo…..are you watching this?

US just entered the war with a tweet?

whiterock said:

---

4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.

---

Your old man brain is still 30 years in the past.

China is capable of doing anything we are... the only question is whether or not they are as crazy and lack self-preservation instincts to the same extreme degree that we seem to.

The_barBEARian said:

---

whiterock said:

---

4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.

---

Your old man brain is still 30 years in the past.

China is capable of doing anything we are... the only question is whether or not they are as crazy and lack self-preservation instincts to the same extreme degree that we seem to.

---

China can't even control the China sea

The_barBEARian said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Its about both, and I don't think Israel has made any secret about that interest. Iran hasn't made their regime change interests for Israel a secret either.

EDIT: Except Trump apparently held Israel back from actually completing it.

---

Killing Khamenei and his son still wouldn't have ended the regime. It would have only made them martyrs.

You America Last guys never learn.

Iranian society was slowly changing and abandoning Islamism as evidence by the current moderate President being elected over the more hardline opponent in their last election.

Now I would expect a lot of the moderates in Iran to join the hardliners bcs Israel just showed them how wrong they were to trust the West.

---

We've heard the same song and dance for the last 30+ years. This isn't the first time that Iran elected a "moderate". The bottom line is the mullahs decide who the president is going to be. Until they're gone it won't matter what president they choose.

You are incredibly nave.

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Israeli casualties continue to mount under relentless Iranian ballistic missile attacks.

No doubt the Israeli military is surprised their defenses haven't been more effective.

Aid from China is already flying into Tehran.

Israel might be in a far worse situation than they ever imagined.

Which means the US could get directly involved; beginning with air strikes from US carriers.

Right now only one carrier group is in the Mediterranean. If addition carrier groups get sent to the region….. the odds of US entering the war goes up dramatically.

---

Question for Whiterock.

The Nimitz is moving into the Gulf. Vinson is already there. These are our oldest CVs. In the Gulf War, the Midway was the flagship and Wisconsin was active, our oldest CV and oldest BB. Is this part of the strategy to put at risk your ships close to decommissioning? By design or luck of the draw. Do not know much about Naval operations.

---

I agree with your calculation of risk. A CBG is a dear thing and significant loss would cost dearly and harm our prestige.

If we do send one into the Persian Gulf, it means:
1) we are going to keep Hormuz open (i.e. closing it risks war with USA.)
2) intel assesses Iranian short-range surface-surface systems have been degraded to the point that risks are acceptable (i.e. Iran has lost most of what could threaten surface craft (thank you Israel) and/or our countermeasures are up to the challenge). If true and demonstrated thusly, it would be a paradigm changer for Chines strategic calculations.
3). The Iranian Kilos are no longer a factor. (surrendered, sunk, or in neutral ports).
4) US Navy does not have stealth mission aircraft (that have been revealed). So for carrier strike missions to succeed,, iranian A2D2 would have to be substantially reduced.

Sending a CBG into the PG at this time is a big dick move. Finest traditions of the US Navy & all that.

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Sure it does. There's evidence that it's a war for both

It may be a war for regime change, but it will look nothing like desert storm 2.0. There will be no ground troops committed to this conflict.

Mothra said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Its about both, and I don't think Israel has made any secret about that interest. Iran hasn't made their regime change interests for Israel a secret either.

EDIT: Except Trump apparently held Israel back from actually completing it.

---

Killing Khamenei and his son still wouldn't have ended the regime. It would have only made them martyrs.

You America Last guys never learn.

Iranian society was slowly changing and abandoning Islamism as evidence by the current moderate President being elected over the more hardline opponent in their last election.

Now I would expect a lot of the moderates in Iran to join the hardliners bcs Israel just showed them how wrong they were to trust the West.

---

We've heard the same song and dance for the last 30+ years. This isn't the first time that I ran elected a "moderate". The bottom line is the mullahs decide who the president is going to be. Until they're gone it won't matter what president they choose.

---

Exactly. He's moving goalposts as needed to justify letting the Mullahs hold the world hostage to their jihadist delusions of grandeur.

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

ATL Bear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Its about both, and I don't think Israel has made any secret about that interest. Iran hasn't made their regime change interests for Israel a secret either.

EDIT: Except Trump apparently held Israel back from actually completing it.

---

Killing Khamenei and his son still wouldn't have ended the regime. It would have only made them martyrs.

You America Last guys never learn.

Iranian society was slowly changing and abandoning Islamism as evidence by the current moderate President being elected over the more hardline opponent in their last election.

Now I would expect a lot of the moderates in Iran to join the hardliners bcs Israel just showed them how wrong they were to trust the West.

---

We've heard the same song and dance for the last 30+ years. This isn't the first time that I ran elected a "moderate". The bottom line is the mullahs decide who the president is going to be. Until they're gone it won't matter what president they choose.

---

Exactly. He's moving goalposts as needed to justify letting the Mullahs hold the world hostage to their jihadist delusions of grandeur.

---

For all his complaints about old people, he's definitely showing his age. He's not a student of history apparently.

Mothra said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Sure it does. There's evidence that it's a war for both

It may be a war for regime change, but it will look nothing like desert storm 2.0. There will be no ground troops committed to this conflict.

---

As I have posted earlier, the mullahs have made it clear they are not going to stop pursuit of nuclear capability. Ergo, regime change is the only outcome that will solve the core problem. Here's Newt chiming in on point

The United States does not need to use B-2bombers to drop giant bombs on the nuclear facility at Fordow which is buried half a kilometer below the mountains near Qom. The strategic goal should be to replace the religious dictatorship with a reasonable government which dismantles…

— Newt Gingrich (@newtgingrich) June 16, 2025

ron.reagan said:

---

US just entered the war with a tweet?

---

Nope. Trump just created huge traffic jams in Tehran making it nearly impossible to resupply rocket launchers in the area. Also escort vehicles in the area will announce their location with emergency lights as they try to get through the traffic jam aiding the IDF in finding targets.

Trump created a logistical nightmare for Iran with a tweet.

LIB,MR BEARS said:

---

ron.reagan said:

---

US just entered the war with a tweet?

---

Nope. Trump just created huge traffic jams in Tehran making it nearly impossible to resupply rocket launchers in the area. Also escort vehicles in the area will announce their location with emergency lights as they try to get through the traffic jam.

Trump created a logistical nightmare for Iran with a tweet. The IDF will take care of the rest.

---

You are giving this guy a bit too much credit I think. Unfortunately I think we will be in this war in 24 hours

whiterock said:

---

Mothra said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Sure it does. There's evidence that it's a war for both

It may be a war for regime change, but it will look nothing like desert storm 2.0. There will be no ground troops committed to this conflict.

---

As I have posted earlier, the mullahs have made it clear they are not going to stop pursuit of nuclear capability. Ergo, regime change is the only outcome that will solve the core problem. Here's Newt chiming in on point

The United States does not need to use B-2bombers to drop giant bombs on the nuclear facility at Fordow which is buried half a kilometer below the mountains near Qom. The strategic goal should be to replace the religious dictatorship with a reasonable government which dismantles…

— Newt Gingrich (@newtgingrich) June 16, 2025

---

Stop advocating for Regime Change. All you are doing is putting Americans on the hook to finance this and place our troops there. Enough already.

— Kate (@kate_p45) June 16, 2025

Go off Queen!

ron.reagan said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

whiterock said:

---

4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.

---

Your old man brain is still 30 years in the past.

China is capable of doing anything we are... the only question is whether or not they are as crazy and lack self-preservation instincts to the same extreme degree that we seem to.

---

China can't even control the China sea

---

Care to explain why we lose every war scenario defending Taiwan from Chinese invasion?

Hasnt Boomer hubris already gotten enough Americans killed in stupid foreign wars?

The_barBEARian said:

---

ron.reagan said:

---

The_barBEARian said:

---

whiterock said:

---

4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.

---

Your old man brain is still 30 years in the past.

China is capable of doing anything we are... the only question is whether or not they are as crazy and lack self-preservation instincts to the same extreme degree that we seem to.

---

China can't even control the China sea

---

Care to explain why we lose every war scenario defending Taiwan from Chinese invasion?

Hasnt Boomer hubris already gotten enough Americans killed in stupid foreign wars?

---

1. We certainly don't

2. The same scenario authors that had us fighting Iran Navy for the first 24 hours of Iran invasion?

Sam Lowry said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Yep.

---

What?

Iran at this very moment could accept Trump's enrichment limit and inspections deal, and the war would end.

sombear said:

---

Sam Lowry said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Yep.

---

What?

Iran at this very moment could accept Trump's enrichment limit and inspections deal, and the war would end.

---

lol.

No it wouldnt.

whiterock said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

Sometimes it pays to read opposition press

Closure of Strait of Hormuz seriously being reviewed by Iran, lawmaker says
https://english.alarabiya.net/News/middle-east/2025/06/14/closure-of-strait-of-hormuz-seriously-being-reviewed-by-iran-lawmaker-says

What is the Strait of Hormuz, could it factor into Israel-Iran conflict?
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/6/14/what-is-the-strait-of-hormuz-could-it-factor-into-israel-iran-conflict

Hopefully Trump has the guts to resist the Israeli push to war, but I'm starting to doubt it. From defunding Ukraine to deporting illegals he seems to be taking several steps backwards recently.

Whiterock and his CIA/MI complex buddies may just get the third world war they are lobbying for.

---

Doubt the Russians get directly involved......they already have their hands full.

China's economy needs the US far more than Iran.

Right now.....doubt WW3 is likely regardless if the US gets involved or not.

---

Correct. In addition……

1) Closure of Hormuz hurts China as much as anyone else. They probably cut Iran off.
2) closure of Hormuz brings in the rest of the Gulf states and Nato to reopen it. (I.E. more incoming arty and air forces making craters in Iran.).
3) we've sunk the entire Iranian Navy before and can easily do so again. In minutes.
4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.
5) (I could go on for quite a while…..)

Iran is not a serious power for anything other than playing disrupter to status quo. It has suffered total loss of its two largest and most capable proxies, and its third has been degraded to level of annoyance. Its antique AF is gone. Russia cannot afford to help it and will more likely seek to leverage the Iranian plight to its benefit in Ukraine negotiations. And China will do nothing more than loan them money to buy stuff to stay in the fight (just to bleed western arsenals).

Trump is playing this beautifully. Standing back and letting Israel do the dirty work while making ambiguous public statements that keep distance and options open, and quietly helping Israel enough to keep up the pressure. The only pathway the mullahs have for peaceful resolution is to let the international community haul out all the remaining nuclear stuff.

Life expectancy for Iranian nuclear scientists at this time is weeks/months. Mosssd will get them all before we hang our Christmas ornaments.

The only thing we should be upset about is that it took us decades too long to get to this point.

NoKo…..are you watching this?

---

Excellent additions.

Well done.

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Israeli casualties continue to mount under relentless Iranian ballistic missile attacks.

No doubt the Israeli military is surprised their defenses haven't been more effective.

Aid from China is already flying into Tehran.

Israel might be in a far worse situation than they ever imagined.

Which means the US could get directly involved; beginning with air strikes from US carriers.

Right now only one carrier group is in the Mediterranean. If addition carrier groups get sent to the region….. the odds of US entering the war goes up dramatically.

---

Question for Whiterock.

The Nimitz is moving into the Gulf. Vinson is already there. These are our oldest CVs. In the Gulf War, the Midway was the flagship and Wisconsin was active, our oldest CV and oldest BB. Is this part of the strategy to put at risk your ships close to decommissioning? By design or luck of the draw. Do not know much about Naval operations.

---

I agree with your calculation of risk. A CBG is a dear thing and significant loss would cost dearly and harm our prestige.

If we do send one into the Persian Gulf, it means:
1) we are going to keep Hormuz open (i.e. closing it risks war with USA.)
2) intel assesses Iranian short-range surface-surface systems have been degraded to the point that risks are acceptable (i.e. Iran has lost most of what could threaten surface craft (thank you Israel) and/or our countermeasures are up to the challenge). If true and demonstrated thusly, it would be a paradigm changer for Chines strategic calculations.
3). The Iranian Kilos are no longer a factor. (surrendered, sunk, or in neutral ports).
4) US Navy does not have stealth mission aircraft (that have been revealed). So for carrier strike missions to succeed,, iranian A2D2 would have to be substantially reduced.

Sending a CBG into the PG at this time is a big dick move. Finest traditions of the US Navy & all that.

---

Another well thought out post.

Carriers are on the verge of becoming obsolete.

Cheap drones can overwhelm a cv's defensive shield and ignite the mult billion dollar floating bomb and jet fuel storage facility.

Killing 5000 sailors in the process.

KaiBear said:

---

whiterock said:

---

FLBear5630 said:

---

KaiBear said:

---

Israeli casualties continue to mount under relentless Iranian ballistic missile attacks.

No doubt the Israeli military is surprised their defenses haven't been more effective.

Aid from China is already flying into Tehran.

Israel might be in a far worse situation than they ever imagined.

Which means the US could get directly involved; beginning with air strikes from US carriers.

Right now only one carrier group is in the Mediterranean. If addition carrier groups get sent to the region….. the odds of US entering the war goes up dramatically.

---

Question for Whiterock.

The Nimitz is moving into the Gulf. Vinson is already there. These are our oldest CVs. In the Gulf War, the Midway was the flagship and Wisconsin was active, our oldest CV and oldest BB. Is this part of the strategy to put at risk your ships close to decommissioning? By design or luck of the draw. Do not know much about Naval operations.

---

I agree with your calculation of risk. A CBG is a dear thing and significant loss would cost dearly and harm our prestige.

If we do send one into the Persian Gulf, it means:
1) we are going to keep Hormuz open (i.e. closing it risks war with USA.)
2) intel assesses Iranian short-range surface-surface systems have been degraded to the point that risks are acceptable (i.e. Iran has lost most of what could threaten surface craft (thank you Israel) and/or our countermeasures are up to the challenge). If true and demonstrated thusly, it would be a paradigm changer for Chines strategic calculations.
3). The Iranian Kilos are no longer a factor. (surrendered, sunk, or in neutral ports).
4) US Navy does not have stealth mission aircraft (that have been revealed). So for carrier strike missions to succeed,, iranian A2D2 would have to be substantially reduced.

Sending a CBG into the PG at this time is a big dick move. Finest traditions of the US Navy & all that.

---

Another well thought out post.

Carriers are on the verge of becoming obsolete.

Cheap drones can overwhelm a cv's defensive shield and ignite the mult billion dollar floating bomb and jet fuel storage facility.

Killing 5000 sailors in the process.

---

Drones are the new Air Force, until effective electronic/EMP countermeasures get involved.

Toppling the Iranian regime, an act that would almost inevitably trigger collapse and civil war, would be the Syria effect on steroids. Iran is 5x larger than Syria, and unlike Syria, it’s not bordered by fellow Shiite nations capable of absorbing even a fraction of the fallout.… https://t.co/O1mR3e9Bxy

— Zarathustra (@zarathustra5150) June 16, 2025

Sam Lowry said:

---

Realitybites said:

---

This is a war for Regime Change. Desert Storm 2.0. It has nothing to do with Iranian nukes.

---

Yep.

---

Isreal is now attacking civilian infrastructure.

Doc Holliday said:

---

Toppling the Iranian regime, an act that would almost inevitably trigger collapse and civil war, would be the Syria effect on steroids. Iran is 5x larger than Syria, and unlike Syria, it’s not bordered by fellow Shiite nations capable of absorbing even a fraction of the fallout.… https://t.co/O1mR3e9Bxy

— Zarathustra (@zarathustra5150) June 16, 2025

---

We pay the price so they can expand their empire and realize Greater Israel.

The_barBEARian said:

---

Doc Holliday said:

---

Toppling the Iranian regime, an act that would almost inevitably trigger collapse and civil war, would be the Syria effect on steroids. Iran is 5x larger than Syria, and unlike Syria, it’s not bordered by fellow Shiite nations capable of absorbing even a fraction of the fallout.… https://t.co/O1mR3e9Bxy

— Zarathustra (@zarathustra5150) June 16, 2025

---

We pay the price so they can expand their empire and realize Greater Israel.

---

Bush regime, then Obama regime, then Biden regime worked tirelessly to benefit Iran.

In 2019 John Kerry and the EU created INSTEX (a SWIFT alternative) to thwart Trump 45's Iranian sanctions and keep Iran well funded and its military well lubricated and ready for war.

It was… pic.twitter.com/5PgRVRyVbz

— Adam Townsend (@adamscrabble) June 17, 2025

The_barBEARian said:

---

whiterock said:

---

4) China cannot project anywhere remotely in vicinity of the military power it would take to reopen it and/or interdict US/allied operations. Completely out of Chinese range for anything other than futile gestures.

---

Your old man brain is still 30 years in the past.

China is capable of doing anything we are... the only question is whether or not they are as crazy and lack self-preservation instincts to the same extreme degree that we seem to.

---

You really believe China can project, outside of financially? They have zero blue water capabilities and their Air Force is restricted to operating in China. That is why they invested so heavy in missiles, they can't do the other. Having the equipment is not having a capability.