80sBEAR said:

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D. C. Bear said:

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80sBEAR said:

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boognish_bear said:

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If true, this is great news! But who is "we" and why no mention of a source? If this is true, why did not such a tweet not come out of either Matt Rhule or Baylor Football? If this is the truth, there should not be any legal ramifications for them stating that he was not a part of the equestrian incident. One single tweet given by a generic, anonymous Twitter account and no accompanying story make me a little skeptical. I am sorry, but the trust has been gone for about two years.

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Isn't Sicemsports a known twitter account? Are they generally reliable or not?
(Real questions).

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I don't know much about them, but yes, they are known Twitter account. By saying generic and anonymous, I was just saying their was no individual name attached to the tweet

I would love to see the individual that posted it take responsibility and put his or her name by the tweet. If you back your claim or your story , I don't see why that should be a problem. Isn't that how journalistic integrity works? But then perhaps I am giving fan sites a little too much credit.

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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80sBEAR said:

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boognish_bear said:

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If true, this is great news! But who is "we" and why no mention of a source? If this is true, why did not such a tweet not come out of either Matt Rhule or Baylor Football? If this is the truth, there should not be any legal ramifications for them stating that he was not a part of the equestrian incident. One single tweet given by a generic, anonymous Twitter account and no accompanying story make me a little skeptical. I am sorry, but the trust has been gone for about two years.

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Good God son, that's the official Twitter account for the Baylor Rivals site. They're not as good as the site owners here, but they're certainly credible. Plus, I already told you that Ogor was not involved.

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Jacques Strap said:

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I don't understand why BU and CMR could not have made this statement themselves and clearly on the day of the Spring press conference. Totally not fair to Eric Ogor to have people wonder if he was mixed up in the equestrian sexual mess if BU clearly knew he was not. Assuming of course the sources for this tweet are accurate. WTH Baylor, you can do better than this. You should do better than this.

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80sBEAR said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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80sBEAR said:

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boognish_bear said:

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If true, this is great news! But who is "we" and why no mention of a source? If this is true, why did not such a tweet not come out of either Matt Rhule or Baylor Football? If this is the truth, there should not be any legal ramifications for them stating that he was not a part of the equestrian incident. One single tweet given by a generic, anonymous Twitter account and no accompanying story make me a little skeptical. I am sorry, but the trust has been gone for about two years.

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Good God son, that's the official Twitter account for the Baylor Rivals site. They're not as good as the site owners here, but they're certainly credible. Plus, I already told you that Ogor was not involved.

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Good God son, I hope you are right. I agree with Jacques. Why did Rhule, Baylor Football, or Baylor not issue the statement?

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• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

Jacques Strap said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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I don't understand why BU and CMR could not have made this statement themselves and clearly on the day of the Spring press conference. Totally not fair to Eric Ogor to have people wonder if he was mixed up in the equestrian sexual mess if BU clearly knew he was not. Assuming of course the sources for this tweet are accurate. WTH Baylor, you can do better than this. You should do better than this.

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https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.html

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BS and you know it. BU can say he was suspended but it was not for sexual assault.

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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I don't understand why BU and CMR could not have made this statement themselves and clearly on the day of the Spring press conference. Totally not fair to Eric Ogor to have people wonder if he was mixed up in the equestrian sexual mess if BU clearly knew he was not. Assuming of course the sources for this tweet are accurate. WTH Baylor, you can do better than this. You should do better than this.

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https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.html

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BS and you know it. BU can say he was suspended but it was not for sexual assault.

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I see. That's good to know.

Since you are clearly so knowledgeable in these matters, and to fully convince any on here that might be silly enough to doubt you know what you're talking about, would you mind briefly listing out all your personal credentials that have led to you becoming widely recognized as an expert on Federal Privacy Law?

Thanks in advance.

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Keyser Soze said:

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FERPA Defines an Education Record
Education records include a range of information about a student that is maintained in schools in any recorded way, such as handwriting, print, computer media, video or audio tape, film, microfilm, and microfiche. Examples are:

• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

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Malbec said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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FERPA Defines an Education Record
Education records include a range of information about a student that is maintained in schools in any recorded way, such as handwriting, print, computer media, video or audio tape, film, microfilm, and microfiche. Examples are:

• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

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There's way more to it than those generalities. Every school, conference, and the NCAA itself would be in violation. Every school publishes information concerning the student-athlete's course of study, date of birth and photograph. Some of that information is disseminated when a student-athlete makes an all-academic team, or conference honor roll. Universities publish Deans' Lists and other awards. It is common to announce completion of a degree. Virtually every item listed there outside of student ID and social security numbers, emergency contacts and special education records are routinely available to anyone wanting to find it.

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D. C. Bear said:

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Malbec said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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FERPA Defines an Education Record
Education records include a range of information about a student that is maintained in schools in any recorded way, such as handwriting, print, computer media, video or audio tape, film, microfilm, and microfiche. Examples are:

• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

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There's way more to it than those generalities. Every school, conference, and the NCAA itself would be in violation. Every school publishes information concerning the student-athlete's course of study, date of birth and photograph. Some of that information is disseminated when a student-athlete makes an all-academic team, or conference honor roll. Universities publish Deans' Lists and other awards. It is common to announce completion of a degree. Virtually every item listed there outside of student ID and social security numbers, emergency contacts and special education records are routinely available to anyone wanting to find it.

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Students may sign a release, but disclosing grades without one will get you in trouble. Didn't UT basketball find that out a number of years ago? In any event disciplinary records are clearly protected.

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Malbec said:

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D. C. Bear said:

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Malbec said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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FERPA Defines an Education Record
Education records include a range of information about a student that is maintained in schools in any recorded way, such as handwriting, print, computer media, video or audio tape, film, microfilm, and microfiche. Examples are:

• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

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There's way more to it than those generalities. Every school, conference, and the NCAA itself would be in violation. Every school publishes information concerning the student-athlete's course of study, date of birth and photograph. Some of that information is disseminated when a student-athlete makes an all-academic team, or conference honor roll. Universities publish Deans' Lists and other awards. It is common to announce completion of a degree. Virtually every item listed there outside of student ID and social security numbers, emergency contacts and special education records are routinely available to anyone wanting to find it.

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Students may sign a release, but disclosing grades without one will get you in trouble. Didn't UT basketball find that out a number of years ago? In any event disciplinary records are clearly protected.

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If that were true, then the whole argument would be moot, since every single player on the roster has a good deal of this "restricted" information published in media guides and websites. If they have already waived via a release, the excuse of privacy does not exist.

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D. C. Bear said:

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Malbec said:

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D. C. Bear said:

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Malbec said:

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Keyser Soze said:

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FERPA Defines an Education Record
Education records include a range of information about a student that is maintained in schools in any recorded way, such as handwriting, print, computer media, video or audio tape, film, microfilm, and microfiche. Examples are:

• Date and place of birth, parent(s) and/or guardian addresses, and where parents can be contacted in emergencies;
• Grades, test scores, courses taken, academic specializations and activities, and official letters regarding a student's status in school;
• Special education records;
• Disciplinary records;
• Medical and health records that the school creates or collects and maintains;
• Documentation of attendance, schools attended, courses taken, awards conferred, and degrees earned;
• Personal information such as a student's identification code, social security number,picture, or other information that would make it easy to identify or locate a student.

---

There's way more to it than those generalities. Every school, conference, and the NCAA itself would be in violation. Every school publishes information concerning the student-athlete's course of study, date of birth and photograph. Some of that information is disseminated when a student-athlete makes an all-academic team, or conference honor roll. Universities publish Deans' Lists and other awards. It is common to announce completion of a degree. Virtually every item listed there outside of student ID and social security numbers, emergency contacts and special education records are routinely available to anyone wanting to find it.

---

Students may sign a release, but disclosing grades without one will get you in trouble. Didn't UT basketball find that out a number of years ago? In any event disciplinary records are clearly protected.

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If that were true, then the whole argument would be moot, since every single player on the roster has a good deal of this "restricted" information published in media guides and websites. If they have already waived via a release, the excuse of privacy does not exist.

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If disciplinary records were protected, the whole argument would be moot? Not seeing the logic.

I know you can't talk about individual's grades without a release.

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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80sBEAR said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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I don't understand why BU and CMR could not have made this statement themselves and clearly on the day of the Spring press conference. Totally not fair to Eric Ogor to have people wonder if he was mixed up in the equestrian sexual mess if BU clearly knew he was not. Assuming of course the sources for this tweet are accurate. WTH Baylor, you can do better than this. You should do better than this.

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https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.html

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BS and you know it. BU can say he was suspended but it was not for sexual assault.

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I see. That's good to know.

Since you are clearly so knowledgeable in these matters, and to fully convince any on here that might be silly enough to doubt you know what you're talking about, would you mind briefly listing out all your personal credentials that have led to you becoming widely recognized as an expert on Federal Privacy Law?

Thanks in advance.

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Really no need to be so condescending. It is not helpful. I read bullet point #2 on your link and have to wonder. Let's say we were talking about armed robbery. You are claiming that legally it is in a university's best interest to remain silent when the university's previous press releases and statements indirectly implicated the student in the armed robbery? I respectfully disagree.

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1. Jaques said it's "BS and you know it" that Baylor could comment with detail regarding Ogor's suspension and disciplinary records. No, I didn't know that, but apparently he does. In fact, he commented so strongly that it's abundantly clear that he's an expert on these matters, so I invited him to dispel any notion to the contrary.

2. I don't see anywhere in Federal Privacy Law where it concerns itself with putting an institution's "best interest" above student privacy. I'd submit that is a good thing.

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Jacques Strap said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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80sBEAR said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

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PervertedLittleTarts said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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I don't understand why BU and CMR could not have made this statement themselves and clearly on the day of the Spring press conference. Totally not fair to Eric Ogor to have people wonder if he was mixed up in the equestrian sexual mess if BU clearly knew he was not. Assuming of course the sources for this tweet are accurate. WTH Baylor, you can do better than this. You should do better than this.

---

https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.html

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BS and you know it. BU can say he was suspended but it was not for sexual assault.

---

I see. That's good to know.

Since you are clearly so knowledgeable in these matters, and to fully convince any on here that might be silly enough to doubt you know what you're talking about, would you mind briefly listing out all your personal credentials that have led to you becoming widely recognized as an expert on Federal Privacy Law?

Thanks in advance.

---

Really no need to be so condescending. It is not helpful. I read bullet point #2 on your link and have to wonder. Let's say we were talking about armed robbery. You are claiming that legally it is in a university's best interest to remain silent when the university's previous press releases and statements indirectly implicated the student in the armed robbery? I respectfully disagree.

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1. Jaques said it's "BS and you know it" that Baylor could comment with detail regarding Ogor's suspension and disciplinary records. No, I didn't know that, but apparently he does. In fact, he commented so strongly that it's abundantly clear that he's an expert on these matters, so I invited him to dispel any notion to the contrary.

2. I don't see anywhere in Federal Privacy Law where it concerns itself with putting an institution's "best interest" above student privacy. I'd submit that is a good thing.

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So you are suggesting Baylor is able to say he "was suspended for violating team rules" but is not able to say he "was suspended for violating team rules that did not involve sexual assault".

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bear2be2 said:

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80sBEAR said:

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From USA Today:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/big12/2018/03/14/baylor-coach-two-football-players-separated-team-sexual-assault-allegations/424320002/

So basically Matt Rhule is saying, "Okay folks. We've got four alleged sexual predators on campus. Here's their names. Well, there may only be one............but there might be four.........don't you worry though. We are going to get to the bottom of this."

We have the absolute worst Public Relations department in the history of the world. Absolutely HORRIBLE.Or perhaps Baylor should hire a new group of highly compensated lawyers and replace the ones we have.

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He should be talking about what an impact those alleged to have committed sexual assault will have on the field this fall and refer to it as "just something they're dealing with," like the former staff, right? I don't ever remember you criticizing that approach, so I can only assume you view that as the proper one from a public relations standpoint.

You CABers are so full of **** . You don't care about anything but touchdowns and water cooler bragging rights. To see some of you rip this staff for its handling of issues that went largely unaddressed in the past -- and certainly without the feigned outrage and righteous indignation we see here -- is hilarious.

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Chanceux said:

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Here's an idea. Somebody in the AD's office could have told Ogor that before the press conference if he wished he coulda called somebody over at the Trib and told them that he wasn't part of any sexual assault case. Does Ogor have a twitter page? He could have just posted that on there. Or his facebook. Or bout any other way in the world. There's nothing stopping him from saying that he's not part of an investigation.

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Chanceux said:

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Here's an idea. Somebody in the AD's office could have told Ogor that before the press conference if he wished he coulda called somebody over at the Trib and told them that he wasn't part of any sexual assault case. Does Ogor have a twitter page? He could have just posted that on there. Or his facebook. Or bout any other way in the world. There's nothing stopping him from saying that he's not part of an investigation.

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Chanceux said:

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Here's an idea. Somebody in the AD's office could have told Ogor that before the press conference if he wished he coulda called somebody over at the Trib and told them that he wasn't part of any sexual assault case. Does Ogor have a twitter page? He could have just posted that on there. Or his facebook. Or bout any other way in the world. There's nothing stopping him from saying that he's not part of an investigation.

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bear2be2 said:

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I'm not angry. Just tired of the same old disingenuous nonsense from a group of people who couldn't be moved to care about these things until Briles was fired. And now all of the sudden they're very concerned that Rhule's not handling things properly, despite all evidence to the contrary.

For the record, my standard for Rhule is exactly the same as it was for Briles. If it becomes clear he no longer deserves the benefit of the doubt in this area, he'll lose it with me in a hurry. But there is no evidence currently to suggest that's the case. And frankly, as long as he's doing the right things behind the scenes, I don't care whether or not KWTX or ESPN or anyone else is satisfied with his performance.

As to this particular situation, I'll say a couple of things:

First, no one but you seems to think Ogor was involved in a Title IX case. a) He was in enough trouble at the end of the year that his return to the program was in doubt, so it only makes sense that this is an extension of that, and b) it was reported multiple times by multiple outlets that the alleged offenders were redshirt freshmen, thus eliminating Ogor from consideration.

Second, the decision to identify/not identify the players is a two-sided coin. While not doing so leaves some ambiguity as to who is/is not involved, it also protects the identify (to some degree) of players who are still waiting for due process to play out. As soon as those names become public, they become rapists in the minds of many. Any coach that would go out of his way to let that happen to guys who haven't even been indicted yet doesn't have his players' best interests at heart. All this is at this point is an allegation. Once they're indicted and arraigned, they're fair game. That's all public record. Until then, it's best to separate the players from the team, hand the case to the proper people and let justice be served in a way that's fair to both the accuser and accused, which -- not coincidentally -- is exactly what Rhule did here.

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ColomboLQ said:

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bear2be2 said:

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80sBEAR said:

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bear2be2 said:

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80sBEAR said:

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From USA Today:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/big12/2018/03/14/baylor-coach-two-football-players-separated-team-sexual-assault-allegations/424320002/

So basically Matt Rhule is saying, "Okay folks. We've got four alleged sexual predators on campus. Here's their names. Well, there may only be one............but there might be four.........don't you worry though. We are going to get to the bottom of this."

We have the absolute worst Public Relations department in the history of the world. Absolutely HORRIBLE.Or perhaps Baylor should hire a new group of highly compensated lawyers and replace the ones we have.

---

He should be talking about what an impact those alleged to have committed sexual assault will have on the field this fall and refer to it as "just something they're dealing with," like the former staff, right? I don't ever remember you criticizing that approach, so I can only assume you view that as the proper one from a public relations standpoint.

You CABers are so full of **** . You don't care about anything but touchdowns and water cooler bragging rights. To see some of you rip this staff for its handling of issues that went largely unaddressed in the past -- and certainly without the feigned outrage and righteous indignation we see here -- is hilarious.

---

Why are you so angry? Briles screwed up and none of what happened was Rhule's fault.

But can you honestly say you have no problem with Rhule's vague and ambiguous quote in the USA Today article? I think if I was the parent of any one of those boys I would be absolutely PISSED at Baylor if my son was implicated in a sexual assault incident that he was not a part of. I really don't think there is anything hilarious about any of it.

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I'm not angry. Just tired of the same old disingenuous nonsense from a group of people who couldn't be moved to care about these things until Briles was fired. And now all of the sudden they're very concerned that Rhule's not handling things properly, despite all evidence to the contrary.

For the record, my standard for Rhule is exactly the same as it was for Briles. If it becomes clear he no longer deserves the benefit of the doubt in this area, he'll lose it with me in a hurry. But there is no evidence currently to suggest that's the case. And frankly, as long as he's doing the right things behind the scenes, I don't care whether or not KWTX or ESPN or anyone else is satisfied with his performance.

As to this particular situation, I'll say a couple of things:

First, no one but you seems to think Ogor was involved in a Title IX case. a) He was in enough trouble at the end of the year that his return to the program was in doubt, so it only makes sense that this is an extension of that, and b) it was reported multiple times by multiple outlets that the alleged offenders were redshirt freshmen, thus eliminating Ogor from consideration.

Second, the decision to identify/not identify the players is a two-sided coin. While not doing so leaves some ambiguity as to who is/is not involved, it also protects the identify (to some degree) of players who are still waiting for due process to play out. As soon as those names become public, they become rapists in the minds of many. Any coach that would go out of his way to let that happen to guys who haven't even been indicted yet doesn't have his players' best interests at heart. All this is at this point is an allegation. Once they're indicted and arraigned, they're fair game. That's all public record. Until then, it's best to separate the players from the team, hand the case to the proper people and let justice be served in a way that's fair to both the accuser and accused, which -- not coincidentally -- is exactly what Rhule did here.

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What would happen if say, some people like the toBOR allowed the all Baylor players are rapists narrative to continue in the minds of many, would that mean they also would not have the players' best interests at heart? Are they held to that same standard?

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