Ukraine invaded by Putin

68,267 Views | 1093 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by HuMcK
Redbrickbear
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ATL Bear said:

Doc Holliday said:


His brain must be broken. The Orange Revolution was a decade earlier in Ukraine.
I think he is referring to the Maidan protests in 2014.

That saw the Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych (pro-Russian) taken out of power and replaced by Petro Poroshenko (pro-EU/USA)

Many feel the Maidan protests were orchestrated with CIA/State Department help.

Whatever the case half of Ukraine did not support the protests and felt cheated by the throwing out of their guy in favor of Poroshenko.
ATL Bear
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Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

Doc Holliday said:


His brain must be broken. The Orange Revolution was a decade earlier in Ukraine.
I think he is referring to the Maidan protests in 2014.

That saw the Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych (pro-Russian) taken out of power and replaced by Petro Poroshenko (pro-EU/USA)

Many feel the Maidan protests were orchestrated with CIA/State Department help.

Whatever the case half of Ukraine did not support the protests and felt cheated by the throwing out of their guy in favor of Poroshenko.
The Russians poisoned the opposition candidate back in 2004. He survived and won the election. Perspective here.
Mothra
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jupiter said:


Quote:

Yet some of our resident geniuses and 80% the media remain obsessed with Donald Trump .

Yup , Nuclear war, civil war , plague, famine, inflation, crime, poverty etc etc.

It's getting pretty bad out there.

So why did this all come about after Donald Trump and not, say, 8 years of Obama/ Biden, or the previous eight years of Bush, or eight years of Clinton , Bush Sr, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Kennedy etc etc etc.

No other President for 200+ years has had it this bad.

Why now? No other time period has had all of these things start to coalesce together in such a fashion.

Is Donald Trump the aberration?

Or somehow it's Biden, a man who's been a Senator/ Vice President/ President for half a century, suddenly everything goes to hell...but only right after (and also during) 4 years of Trump?




Ah yes, the age-old narrative of pin the blame on the former admin when the admin you voted for is going to hell in a hand basket.

I am sure this will probably blow your mind, but you might consider that it is the current admin's policies that are largely responsible for nuclear war, civil war, plague, famine, inflation, crime, poverty we are now experiencing. Perhaps the clown in this scenario is the current inhabitant of the Oval Office.
FLBear5630
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ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

Doc Holliday said:


His brain must be broken. The Orange Revolution was a decade earlier in Ukraine.
I think he is referring to the Maidan protests in 2014.

That saw the Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych (pro-Russian) taken out of power and replaced by Petro Poroshenko (pro-EU/USA)

Many feel the Maidan protests were orchestrated with CIA/State Department help.

Whatever the case half of Ukraine did not support the protests and felt cheated by the throwing out of their guy in favor of Poroshenko.
The Russians poisoned the opposition candidate back in 2004. He survived and won the election. Perspective here.
Only perspective to some is USA=bad. Putin=victim just trying to help humanity
Redbrickbear
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RMF5630 said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

Doc Holliday said:


His brain must be broken. The Orange Revolution was a decade earlier in Ukraine.
I think he is referring to the Maidan protests in 2014.

That saw the Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych (pro-Russian) taken out of power and replaced by Petro Poroshenko (pro-EU/USA)

Many feel the Maidan protests were orchestrated with CIA/State Department help.

Whatever the case half of Ukraine did not support the protests and felt cheated by the throwing out of their guy in favor of Poroshenko.
The Russians poisoned the opposition candidate back in 2004. He survived and won the election. Perspective here.
Only perspective to some is USA=bad. Putin=victim just trying to help humanity
I don't think that is fair.

Pointing out that the CIA/State department are involved in internal Ukrainian politics does not mean the USA is "bad".

Its just facing reality. Our government is interfering in the internal politics of another nation.

Of course ATL is also correct. The Russians are interfering as well. Including by poisoning politicians they don't like in Ukraine.

Certainly no one on here thinks Putin is a victim.
FLBear5630
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Redbrickbear said:

RMF5630 said:

ATL Bear said:

Redbrickbear said:

ATL Bear said:

Doc Holliday said:


His brain must be broken. The Orange Revolution was a decade earlier in Ukraine.
I think he is referring to the Maidan protests in 2014.

That saw the Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych (pro-Russian) taken out of power and replaced by Petro Poroshenko (pro-EU/USA)

Many feel the Maidan protests were orchestrated with CIA/State Department help.

Whatever the case half of Ukraine did not support the protests and felt cheated by the throwing out of their guy in favor of Poroshenko.
The Russians poisoned the opposition candidate back in 2004. He survived and won the election. Perspective here.
Only perspective to some is USA=bad. Putin=victim just trying to help humanity
I don't think that is fair.

Pointing out that the CIA/State department are involved in internal Ukrainian politics does not mean the USA is "bad".

Its just facing reality. Our government is interfering in the internal politics of another nation.

Of course ATL is also correct. The Russians are interfering as well. Including by poisoning politicians they don't like in Ukraine.

Certainly no one on here thinks Putin is a victim.
Funny, the only credible reference I can find is to Spetsnaz. No reference to SF or CIA operations outside of a counter-false flag. I do know it is pretty well documented that the Russians send Spetsnaz in to destabilize regions. 97% of the vote was for annexation! Yeah, that was like 2020 Atlanta after the water main broke.

Putin is no victim.
Canada2017
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Russian missiles and aircraft blasting Ukrainian targets almost at will.

Unless France , Great Britain , Poland or Turkey do something dramatic ……this war will be over within a month .

VP Harris's public enthusiasm for Ukraine's admission to NATO in the face of hundreds of thousands of Russian troops along the border will be long remembered in diplomatic circles .
Jacques Strap
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Seems like donating the revenue stream to Ukraine might be a better idea but what do I know.

ShooterTX
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Jacques Strap said:

Seems like donating the revenue stream to Ukraine might be a better idea but what do I know.




What an over inflated ego.
You really think anyone in Russia is gonna care?
"OH no! I can't listen to Pink Floyd!! We gotta end this war now!!!"

What a joke.
ShooterTX
Wrecks Quan Dough
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All in all, they are just another brick in the wall.
Canon
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Amal Shuq-Up said:

All in all, they are just another brick in the wall.


They apparently didn't need "no education", and that's exactly what they got. Stupid rich people are kind of funny though.
william
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scattershooting whilst wondering if vladimir putin qualifies as a 'pig on the wing'?

- KKM

{ sipping coffee }

{ eating donut }

cue the bloated, pompous 16+ watersian megalomaniacal yet actually pretty damn good opus:



... and, yes. it's upside down....

... and backwards.

BID.
Go Bears!
GrowlTowel
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HuMcK said:

Amal Shuq-Up said:

HuMcK said:

RMF5630 said:

Canada2017 said:

RMF5630 said:

Cobretti said:




Well, I sure am glad Biden has N Korea under control.
Very surprised Japan has been so passive with all these N Korean provocations .

As the Japanese know they are a prime target .




Japan is quietly gearing up. They seem to have more faith in themselves, than Biden.


https://nationalinterest.org/blog/reboot/japan-stepping-its-readiness-counter-chinas-actions-198922
Some of y'all really need to learn/accept that not everything in the world has to do with Biden or Trump being in office, or how you can use it to try and score political points.
How convenient of you to say now that we have an angry, confused geriatric and a clueless, lazy bimbo in charge of the executive branch.

But I thought you liked Trump?


Do you really think this was witty?
Your ideas are intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
Cobretti
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HuMcK
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A pro-war Russian media outlet appears to have possibly told the truth, before editing to take the numbers out.
Wrecks Quan Dough
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HuMcK said:

A pro-war Russian media outlet appears to have possibly told the truth, before editing to take the numbers out.

That is more than that dying nation can afford to lose.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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HuMcK said:

A pro-war Russian media outlet appears to have possibly told the truth, before editing to take the numbers out.

Wow!!! If true, the Ukranians seem to be kicking some ass. I have no doubt if the Ukranians hold onto their freedom, Joe Biden on behalf of the American taxpayer will gladly pay the cost of rebuilding their country, even though Russia and Putin are the ones responsible for destroying it! That is just how Joe and the Dems roll.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
nein51
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Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.
D. C. Bear
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nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
nein51
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D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.

That really depends on a lot of different factors.

It really doesn't. They don't have the manpower or weaponry (since this forum refuses the correct word) to win. The best outcome they can hope for is one of Afghanistan where it goes on forever until Russia gets bored. You're talking 43m vs 145m people. One of those being led by a person who simply doesn't care about loss of life. Their fight is admirable but, ultimately, Russia will win unless they simply choose not to.
D. C. Bear
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nein51 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.

That really depends on a lot of different factors.

It really doesn't. They don't have the manpower or matriel to win. The best outcome they can hope for is one of Afghanistan where it goes on forever until Russia gets bored. You're talking 43m vs 145m people. One of those being led by a person who simply doesn't care about loss of life. Their fight is admirable but, ultimately, Russia will win unless they simply choose not to.


"Ultimately" Russia may "choose not to," and a lot of factors can go in to that decision.
nein51
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Let me try a different way. If Russia wants to take Ukraine nothing is going to stop them that doesn't involve NATO forces which will be the beginning of WW3. Ukraine, of it's own accord, does not possess the ability to win this war.
RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.
Agree with you. This is a numbers game. 144 million Russians vs. 43 million Ukranians. A David vs. Goliath story for sure.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
Bear8084
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D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/
FLBear5630
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Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/


Question will be how much does Putin want to lose to get his victory. If he leaves himself vulnerable in other areas he may become a target himself.

Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
Canada2017
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RMF5630 said:

Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/




Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
At this point Putin needs far more in concessions ....just to survive .
FLBear5630
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Canada2017 said:

RMF5630 said:

Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/




Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
At this point Putin needs far more in concessions ....just to survive .


You may be right. It may be everything east of river. If Ukraine can survive, it will end up being closer in size to Belarus, Moldova or the Baltic States. That could be Putins plan, to reduce the size to non-threat levels. Can ukraine keep a port?
HuMcK
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RMF5630 said:

Canada2017 said:

RMF5630 said:

Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/




Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
At this point Putin needs far more in concessions ....just to survive .


You may be right. It may be everything east of river. If Ukraine can survive, it will end up being closer in size to Belarus, Moldova or the Baltic States. That could be Putins plan, to reduce the size to non-threat levels. Can ukraine keep a port?

They have Odesa. Would have been crazy to say this 3 weeks ago, but it's not a given that Russia can even reach Odesa at this point, much less take it.
Canada2017
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HuMcK said:

RMF5630 said:

Canada2017 said:

RMF5630 said:

Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/




Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
At this point Putin needs far more in concessions ....just to survive .


You may be right. It may be everything east of river. If Ukraine can survive, it will end up being closer in size to Belarus, Moldova or the Baltic States. That could be Putins plan, to reduce the size to non-threat levels. Can ukraine keep a port?

They have Odesa. Would have been crazy to say this 3 weeks ago, but it's not a given that Russia can even reach Odesa at this point, much less take it.


Anything is possible .

But the weight of these missile and aircraft strikes are having an accumulated impact on Ukrainian morale.

Suspect when the roads dry up…..the Russian armored division's will have the supplies necessary to advance very rapidly .

Ukraine needs to somehow negotiate an end to the war while they still have some bargaining chips .
ShooterTX
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HuMcK said:

RMF5630 said:

Canada2017 said:

RMF5630 said:

Bear8084 said:

D. C. Bear said:

nein51 said:

Ukraine is fighting a fight they cannot win. I admire their heart and their fight. They are doomed to lose however. It's simply a matter of time.


That really depends on a lot of different factors.
You are correct. So far the Ukrainians have fought much of the Russian pushes to a stalemate and has forced Russia to pretty much abandon what they originally wanted to do (Quick thunder runs into Kyiv and a quick regime change), and now both sides are digging in. Add to the fact that the skies are still contested, Russia has lost 5 very high ranking officers and continues to take losses everyday, and so on and so on. Yes, there is still massive firepower being aimed at Ukraine, but from what has been analyzed on the ground, it is pretty much being fought to a brutal stalemate.

The Institute for the Study of War has verified daily updates about what is happening on the ground:

https://www.understandingwar.org/

And War on the Rocks also has a weekly podcast that updates what is happening:

https://warontherocks.com/2022/03/in-the-fourth-week-is-russia-revising-its-war-aims-amidst-attrition/




Getting the 2 Russian made provinces may be enough.
At this point Putin needs far more in concessions ....just to survive .


You may be right. It may be everything east of river. If Ukraine can survive, it will end up being closer in size to Belarus, Moldova or the Baltic States. That could be Putins plan, to reduce the size to non-threat levels. Can ukraine keep a port?

They have Odesa. Would have been crazy to say this 3 weeks ago, but it's not a given that Russia can even reach Odesa at this point, much less take it.
Pretty sure that they already surrounded Odessa, and are now in a staging position to take it.
I'm betting that they use Odessa as a negotiating chip, along with Kiyv, to get everything else that they want.
I also will be very curious to see how they use the nuclear power plants in negotiations. Will they give them all back, or keep the largest 2 of them as leverage over the rest of Ukraine for the future?
ShooterTX
HuMcK
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The Russians are bogged down in Kherson and Mykolaiv well to the east of Odesa still, Ukrainians have actually been able to drive them out of that area a couple times now. Russia tried to take Odesa in the initial stages with some navy and paratroopers, but the paras got smoked (same story as with Kyiv). They will be able to make a real move west once Mariupol falls, but that's taken them a month of fighting already and Odesa is about 3 times the size of that city.

Some good maps from yesterday below.
BearFan33
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RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

HuMcK said:

A pro-war Russian media outlet appears to have possibly told the truth, before editing to take the numbers out.

Wow!!! If true, the Ukranians seem to be kicking some ass. I have no doubt if the Ukranians hold onto their freedom, Joe Biden on behalf of the American taxpayer will gladly pay the cost of rebuilding their country, even though Russia and Putin are the ones responsible for destroying it! That is just how Joe and the Dems roll.
And don't forget.....hold 10% for the big guy.
FLBear5630
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BearFan33 said:

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

HuMcK said:

A pro-war Russian media outlet appears to have possibly told the truth, before editing to take the numbers out.

Wow!!! If true, the Ukranians seem to be kicking some ass. I have no doubt if the Ukranians hold onto their freedom, Joe Biden on behalf of the American taxpayer will gladly pay the cost of rebuilding their country, even though Russia and Putin are the ones responsible for destroying it! That is just how Joe and the Dems roll.
And don't forget.....hold 10% for the big guy.
"Big Guy" B-I-G G-U-Y says Kamala
HuMcK
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A noticable change in stated objectives.
Jacques Strap
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