Many people have attacked her dad, and rightly so. That's no reason for a savvy politician to risk her career.Harrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:The common wisdom is that Trump can't win again. I'm not totally convinced that's true, but it's the assumption that most of these politicians are likely to be working with.4th and Inches said:lol, Dem internal polling says they cant get a canidate over 50% even with Roe v Wade decision to rally behind..Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
No lifeline, American people vote based on how their life is.. they will vote Dems out and Trump back in because the worse this gets, the more people miss him and his peaceful prosperous years.
For Cheney, that means she wants to keep him from the nomination and preferably keep him off the primary ballot. That means rallying Never Trumpers and letting him know we won't waiver. She (and other sane conservatives) are hoping Republicans will react the way I have.
The Democrats want to make Trump the biggest issue of 2024. They don't think he's a viable candidate, but they like how he takes the oxygen away from everyone else. They're hoping Republicans will react the way you have.
Liz is mad because Trump (a Democrat) attacked her dad.
I don't want Trump to run, but he would likely wipe the floor with any regard morons the Authoritarian Party would nominate.
Jan 6 committee
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Last: 6 mo ago by Harrison Bergeron
Sam Lowry said:Many people have attacked her dad, and rightly so. That's no reason for a savvy politician to risk her career.Harrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:The common wisdom is that Trump can't win again. I'm not totally convinced that's true, but it's the assumption that most of these politicians are likely to be working with.4th and Inches said:lol, Dem internal polling says they cant get a canidate over 50% even with Roe v Wade decision to rally behind..Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
No lifeline, American people vote based on how their life is.. they will vote Dems out and Trump back in because the worse this gets, the more people miss him and his peaceful prosperous years.
For Cheney, that means she wants to keep him from the nomination and preferably keep him off the primary ballot. That means rallying Never Trumpers and letting him know we won't waiver. She (and other sane conservatives) are hoping Republicans will react the way I have.
The Democrats want to make Trump the biggest issue of 2024. They don't think he's a viable candidate, but they like how he takes the oxygen away from everyone else. They're hoping Republicans will react the way you have.
Liz is mad because Trump (a Democrat) attacked her dad.
I don't want Trump to run, but he would likely wipe the floor with any regard morons the Authoritarian Party would nominate.
What indication do you have she's savvy? She a privileged moron who's success is uniquely tied to her war machine father ... until November. P
From Peggy Noonan (quoting David French):Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
"First, Trump summoned the mob to Washington." Second, he "knew the mob was armed and dangerous." Third, he exhorted them to "fight like hell" and march on the Capitol. Ms. Hutchinson said he attempted to lead it himself. Fourth, he further inflamed the mob after the attack began by tweeting: "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what was necessary."
With this fact pattern, his earlier admonition to the crowd to move forward "peacefully and patriotically" looks, to Mr. French's eyes, "more like pro forma ass-covering than a genuine plea. It was a drop of pacifism in an ocean of incitement."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/courage-cassidy-hutchinson-testify-ketchup-wall-steering-wheel-meadows-jan-6-11656626001
More honest than savvyHarrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:Many people have attacked her dad, and rightly so. That's no reason for a savvy politician to risk her career.Harrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:The common wisdom is that Trump can't win again. I'm not totally convinced that's true, but it's the assumption that most of these politicians are likely to be working with.4th and Inches said:lol, Dem internal polling says they cant get a canidate over 50% even with Roe v Wade decision to rally behind..Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
No lifeline, American people vote based on how their life is.. they will vote Dems out and Trump back in because the worse this gets, the more people miss him and his peaceful prosperous years.
For Cheney, that means she wants to keep him from the nomination and preferably keep him off the primary ballot. That means rallying Never Trumpers and letting him know we won't waiver. She (and other sane conservatives) are hoping Republicans will react the way I have.
The Democrats want to make Trump the biggest issue of 2024. They don't think he's a viable candidate, but they like how he takes the oxygen away from everyone else. They're hoping Republicans will react the way you have.
Liz is mad because Trump (a Democrat) attacked her dad.
I don't want Trump to run, but he would likely wipe the floor with any regard morons the Authoritarian Party would nominate.
What indication do you have she's savvy? She a privileged moron who's success is uniquely tied to her war machine father ... until November. P
neverTrumper quoting neverTrumper quoting neverTrumper.....Osodecentx said:From Peggy Noonan (quoting David French):Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
"First, Trump summoned the mob to Washington." Second, he "knew the mob was armed and dangerous." Third, he exhorted them to "fight like hell" and march on the Capitol. Ms. Hutchinson said he attempted to lead it himself. Fourth, he further inflamed the mob after the attack began by tweeting: "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what was necessary."
With this fact pattern, his earlier admonition to the crowd to move forward "peacefully and patriotically" looks, to Mr. French's eyes, "more like pro forma ass-covering than a genuine plea. It was a drop of pacifism in an ocean of incitement."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/courage-cassidy-hutchinson-testify-ketchup-wall-steering-wheel-meadows-jan-6-11656626001
Lots of confirmation bias going on, without moving the needle an inch.
Nobody who doesn't already think J6 was insurrection is going to change their mind, because "not insurrection" is the correct assessment. All the neverTrumpers are doing is marginalizing their future effectiveness in the part of the political spectrum to which they claim to belong. And, to give them credit, most of them really do seem to believe what they are saying. But that only serves to highlight the questionable judgment that will sideline them in the future.
machine politician trying to stop "the monkeys from driving the bus." (a phrase used by the outgoing McLennan County GOP leadership after they lost control of the party.)Osodecentx said:More honest than savvyHarrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:Many people have attacked her dad, and rightly so. That's no reason for a savvy politician to risk her career.Harrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:The common wisdom is that Trump can't win again. I'm not totally convinced that's true, but it's the assumption that most of these politicians are likely to be working with.4th and Inches said:lol, Dem internal polling says they cant get a canidate over 50% even with Roe v Wade decision to rally behind..Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
No lifeline, American people vote based on how their life is.. they will vote Dems out and Trump back in because the worse this gets, the more people miss him and his peaceful prosperous years.
For Cheney, that means she wants to keep him from the nomination and preferably keep him off the primary ballot. That means rallying Never Trumpers and letting him know we won't waiver. She (and other sane conservatives) are hoping Republicans will react the way I have.
The Democrats want to make Trump the biggest issue of 2024. They don't think he's a viable candidate, but they like how he takes the oxygen away from everyone else. They're hoping Republicans will react the way you have.
Liz is mad because Trump (a Democrat) attacked her dad.
I don't want Trump to run, but he would likely wipe the floor with any regard morons the Authoritarian Party would nominate.
What indication do you have she's savvy? She a privileged moron who's success is uniquely tied to her war machine father ... until November. P
Establishments which lose power struggles cannot easily perceive that they actually lost the idea over the future of the party to new and better ideas. They only see a crazed rabble of nutjobs about to ruin what the establishment so carefully built and maintained. RPT went thru that a couple of years back when an embattled chairman resigned mid-cycle and the libertarian wing of the party narrowly won the executive committee vote on a replacement by 1 vote. (I voted for the losing side.) 12 months later, the chairman race ran on schedule at the party convention. The establishment wing put up the daughter of an old (and still well-regarded) lion. Her campaign was mean and divisive. The messaging literally was "don't let the libertarians take over our party." The problem with that is, as I've posted before, libertarianism is the guiding light of the GOP. When you get to the right pole in the party you do not find people with swastikas or white robes. you find Ron Paul. So attacking "libertarians" is cannibalistic, guaranteed to make the party smaller. She lost handily and I voted to re-elect the guy I had not supported 12 months earlier. he'd done a decent job and, frankly, the establishment had proven itself to be repulsively hostile to parts of the party it really wished were not in the party.
Kinda like we see from the neverTrumpers...... They cannot fathom a future in which the party ignores them and moves on. But that is exactly what is going to happen. The Trump faction is not a faction. It is the party. and it will never forget what the neverTrumpers are doing - refusing to play team ball, buying into the narratives of our mutual opponent in order to regain leadership it lost due to its own incompetence.
Bookmark the post. We'll revisit in a year or three to see how it shakes out. Liz Cheney will be a lobbyist in WDC after she loses massively in a state no Republican should ever lose unless caught naked with the proverbial small boy or dead girl. (and frankly, even that old idiom may be passe' these days.)
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Last week I was in a real courtroom, with real lawyers and a real judge, in a real trial following real rules.
So while I am not a lawyer, I have direct, recent experience on what constitutes evidence, as ironically last week a defense attorney was desperately and unsuccessfully trying to get my testimony in a civil case thrown out as hearsay. I did a lot of reading to know the boundaries.
Granted, that was a civil case in Pennsylvania, while the January 6 committee is clearly a political witch hunt in D.C., But the Democrats ae failing dismally to win over anyone. Their supporters were Trump haters before the first gavel, and what little emotion the Democrats have ginned up against Trump will fade like a bad body odor long before the 2022 general election, let alone the 2024 campaign.
You Trump haters are jerking yourselves off. It's kind of silly to imagine that should be exciting anyone else.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
Isn't there a difference between an information gathering hearing vs an actual criminal trial? It seems to me that all the investigative activity has pretty much been done before a criminal trial, whereas in this proceeding the focus is on finding information that follows logical threads.
Under the Constitution, a Congressional committee only has authority to hold hearings for a legislative purpose.Guy Noir said:
Isn't there a difference between an information gathering hearing vs an actual criminal trial? It seems to me that all the investigative activity has pretty much been done before a criminal trial, whereas in this proceeding the focus is on finding information that follows logical threads.
Congress is not law enforcement.
Are you at last admitting this committee is over-reaching its authority?
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
I agree 100% with both statements. Our government is a complete mess of dysfunction, and this committee is just another example of this.Doc Holliday said:You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
I think the disconnect on all of these threads is actually pretty simple.
- I do not think anybody here or very few people think the events of the Capitol riot were good, justified, etc.
- However, that does not this clown show of a Stalin Show Trial is a legitimate effort to find the so-called truth; there have been already too many shenanigans by this group regarding the Russian Hoax and this committee for it to warrant any credibility
The disconnect is between those that are inherently TDSers and will believe literally anything that makes him look bad and those that would like to find the so-called truth about if there was any coordinated effort involving Trump but realize this committee is not the vehicle to do that.
One thing I like about this committee, is that they are pursuing a course that will ensure their loss in 2024, rather than facing Reality and looking for a serious solution.
Politically, the Democrats have been able to put out winning candidates before. Barack Obama and Bill Clinton were brilliant strategists, whatever I think of their policies Joe Biden, in comparison, was an incredibly poor choice, as was Hillary Clinton or Kamala Harris.
The Democrats should be focusing on finding the next Obama, but they obsess on Trump.
I'm not going to waste time discussing Trump's election viability here, except to point out he won in 2016 when all the "smart" money was on Hillary. With Biden's record, it should be obvious that the Democrats are in a bad place.
That's not to say the GOP has been all that smart. If the GOP wants to back Trump, they should do so and be done with letting the TDS crowd create factions. If the GOP really believes Trump cannot win, they should be working to find their leader and get Trump to buy into supporting the new choice,
Trying to shove Trump out is simply going to make him dig in. It's stupid and amounts to a tantrum, which I would expect from the likes of Romney or Cheney. but the RNC should know better.
Politically, the Democrats have been able to put out winning candidates before. Barack Obama and Bill Clinton were brilliant strategists, whatever I think of their policies Joe Biden, in comparison, was an incredibly poor choice, as was Hillary Clinton or Kamala Harris.
The Democrats should be focusing on finding the next Obama, but they obsess on Trump.
I'm not going to waste time discussing Trump's election viability here, except to point out he won in 2016 when all the "smart" money was on Hillary. With Biden's record, it should be obvious that the Democrats are in a bad place.
That's not to say the GOP has been all that smart. If the GOP wants to back Trump, they should do so and be done with letting the TDS crowd create factions. If the GOP really believes Trump cannot win, they should be working to find their leader and get Trump to buy into supporting the new choice,
Trying to shove Trump out is simply going to make him dig in. It's stupid and amounts to a tantrum, which I would expect from the likes of Romney or Cheney. but the RNC should know better.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
I agree with all of your points, except for one. They already searched and didn't find a connection between Trump and the breaking into Congress. They investigated for 14 months and made 700+ arrests. This issue is that for some, I believe you included, is that the only acceptable answer is that he was involved. So, we continue to see these charades until they fabricate something. Leads do not get "hotter" the further away from a crime.Harrison Bergeron said:I agree 100% with both statements. Our government is a complete mess of dysfunction, and this committee is just another example of this.Doc Holliday said:You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
I think the disconnect on all of these threads is actually pretty simple.
- I do not think anybody here or very few people think the events of the Capitol riot were good, justified, etc.
- However, that does not this clown show of a Stalin Show Trial is a legitimate effort to find the so-called truth; there have been already too many shenanigans by this group regarding the Russian Hoax and this committee for it to warrant any credibility
The disconnect is between those that are inherently TDSers and will believe literally anything that makes him look bad and those that would like to find the so-called truth about if there was any coordinated effort involving Trump but realize this committee is not the vehicle to do that.
Trump had a rally. They went to Congress and some idiots used if for their own devices. Trump probably didn't mind after 2020, but I have not heard anything that shows he coordinated it over the 14 month investigation. I guarantee the DOJ used its "A" team on this.
Trump and Forever Trumpers are the Establishment now.whiterock said:machine politician trying to stop "the monkeys from driving the bus." (a phrase used by the outgoing McLennan County GOP leadership after they lost control of the party.)Osodecentx said:More honest than savvyHarrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:Many people have attacked her dad, and rightly so. That's no reason for a savvy politician to risk her career.Harrison Bergeron said:Sam Lowry said:The common wisdom is that Trump can't win again. I'm not totally convinced that's true, but it's the assumption that most of these politicians are likely to be working with.4th and Inches said:lol, Dem internal polling says they cant get a canidate over 50% even with Roe v Wade decision to rally behind..Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
No lifeline, American people vote based on how their life is.. they will vote Dems out and Trump back in because the worse this gets, the more people miss him and his peaceful prosperous years.
For Cheney, that means she wants to keep him from the nomination and preferably keep him off the primary ballot. That means rallying Never Trumpers and letting him know we won't waiver. She (and other sane conservatives) are hoping Republicans will react the way I have.
The Democrats want to make Trump the biggest issue of 2024. They don't think he's a viable candidate, but they like how he takes the oxygen away from everyone else. They're hoping Republicans will react the way you have.
Liz is mad because Trump (a Democrat) attacked her dad.
I don't want Trump to run, but he would likely wipe the floor with any regard morons the Authoritarian Party would nominate.
What indication do you have she's savvy? She a privileged moron who's success is uniquely tied to her war machine father ... until November. P
Establishments which lose power struggles cannot easily perceive that they actually lost the idea over the future of the party to new and better ideas.
Bookmark the post. We'll revisit in a year or three to see how it shakes out.
I'm pretty sure Cheney will lose her primary to the Establishment candidate.
Yeah, Trump and his four years in office are the establishment now, not the lifelong politicians who are still in office...
Our vibrations were getting nasty. But why? I was puzzled, frustrated... Had we deteriorated to the level of dumb beasts?
There is another interpretation of events.RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:I agree 100% with both statements. Our government is a complete mess of dysfunction, and this committee is just another example of this.Doc Holliday said:You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
I think the disconnect on all of these threads is actually pretty simple.
- I do not think anybody here or very few people think the events of the Capitol riot were good, justified, etc.
- However, that does not this clown show of a Stalin Show Trial is a legitimate effort to find the so-called truth; there have been already too many shenanigans by this group regarding the Russian Hoax and this committee for it to warrant any credibility
The disconnect is between those that are inherently TDSers and will believe literally anything that makes him look bad and those that would like to find the so-called truth about if there was any coordinated effort involving Trump but realize this committee is not the vehicle to do that.
Trump had a rally. They went to Congress and some idiots used if for their own devices. Trump probably didn't mind after 2020, but I have not heard anything that shows he coordinated it over the 14 month investigation. I guarantee the DOJ used its "A" team on this.
From Peggy Noonan (quoting David French):
"First, Trump summoned the mob to Washington." Second, he "knew the mob was armed and dangerous." Third, he exhorted them to "fight like hell" and march on the Capitol. Ms. Hutchinson said he attempted to lead it himself. Fourth, he further inflamed the mob after the attack began by tweeting: "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what was necessary."
With this fact pattern, his earlier admonition to the crowd to move forward "peacefully and patriotically" looks, to Mr. French's eyes, "more like pro forma ass-covering than a genuine plea. It was a drop of pacifism in an ocean of incitement."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/courage-cassidy-hutchinson-testify-ketchup-wall-steering-wheel-meadows-jan-6-11656626001
Pretty weak story, but I'm sure Schiff and Pelosi will enjoy it.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
The first sentence for Peggy Noonan in her WSJ article starts....Osodecentx said:There is another interpretation of events.RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:I agree 100% with both statements. Our government is a complete mess of dysfunction, and this committee is just another example of this.Doc Holliday said:You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
I think the disconnect on all of these threads is actually pretty simple.
- I do not think anybody here or very few people think the events of the Capitol riot were good, justified, etc.
- However, that does not this clown show of a Stalin Show Trial is a legitimate effort to find the so-called truth; there have been already too many shenanigans by this group regarding the Russian Hoax and this committee for it to warrant any credibility
The disconnect is between those that are inherently TDSers and will believe literally anything that makes him look bad and those that would like to find the so-called truth about if there was any coordinated effort involving Trump but realize this committee is not the vehicle to do that.
Trump had a rally. They went to Congress and some idiots used if for their own devices. Trump probably didn't mind after 2020, but I have not heard anything that shows he coordinated it over the 14 month investigation. I guarantee the DOJ used its "A" team on this.
From Peggy Noonan (quoting David French):
"First, Trump summoned the mob to Washington." Second, he "knew the mob was armed and dangerous." Third, he exhorted them to "fight like hell" and march on the Capitol. Ms. Hutchinson said he attempted to lead it himself. Fourth, he further inflamed the mob after the attack began by tweeting: "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what was necessary."
With this fact pattern, his earlier admonition to the crowd to move forward "peacefully and patriotically" looks, to Mr. French's eyes, "more like pro forma ass-covering than a genuine plea. It was a drop of pacifism in an ocean of incitement."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/courage-cassidy-hutchinson-testify-ketchup-wall-steering-wheel-meadows-jan-6-11656626001
Quote:
"Only a woman would have done what Cassidy Hutchinson did because only a woman, in a place of such power and prestige, would have registered everything and taken such close notes instead of spending that time swanning around being important"
So if you want to take hook line and sinker the words of an absolute bigot, that lives in a insulated fantasy land such as this, then by all means go for it. Hutchinsons words are no more important or authorative than anybody elses. She didn't even actually witness what she is testifying about.
I can't stand Trump, but I can't stand this abject bull**** either. I'm around young adults and late teen men and women almost every day. There is absolutely nothing she says here factual about a woman being inherently more able than a man in a situation like this. And those that believe this and are in lockstep with her are absolute bigots too.
The key word here is: INTERPRETATIONOsodecentx said:There is another interpretation of events.RMF5630 said:Harrison Bergeron said:I agree 100% with both statements. Our government is a complete mess of dysfunction, and this committee is just another example of this.Doc Holliday said:You're shocked by attacks on the system when you really need to by more shocked by the system itself.Sam Lowry said:
Trumpists and the old GOP establishment have some different ideas about policy (I lean toward the Trumpists in that regard). What they share is an arrogance and amorality that has hampered the conservative agenda again and again. You think that as long as you're ideologically right, honesty and competence don't matter. It's easy to think that when your opponent has the power and you'll do anything to get it back. When you have the power and it's time to deliver on your promises, it turns out those things matter a lot. That's why, when Dubya abused the public's trust beyond endurance, we ended up with eight years of Obama at a time when Republicans should have been poised to dominate at the national level. Trump has done the same, only worse.
Sure, the Dems play dirty. We can agree on that, so spare me the diatribe you're probably composing in your mind already. But they play dirty within normal bounds. They push the idea of court-packing, but when public opinion pushes back they retreat. They pander to extremists, but they don't actually lead riots. When we saw Kamala making excuses for BLM, we should have said "we're better than that." Instead we said "hold my beer." We didn't just turn a blind eye to sedition, we made ourselves the poster boy for it. That's not showing strength. It's showing your ass. Lucy sets up the football, and you go charging in again…every time.
Today you can pay for policy and propaganda. There's hardly any representation anymore.
I think you're downplaying how bad things really are and will continue to get. 20 year failed wars costing $7 trillion aren't accidents. They're rackets. Our omnibus bills and pork spending will turn the middle class into the lower class over time if nothing changes. We police and bully the west who is dependent on our taxpayers.
Our Republic has been for sale for quite some time and people recognize it.
I think the disconnect on all of these threads is actually pretty simple.
- I do not think anybody here or very few people think the events of the Capitol riot were good, justified, etc.
- However, that does not this clown show of a Stalin Show Trial is a legitimate effort to find the so-called truth; there have been already too many shenanigans by this group regarding the Russian Hoax and this committee for it to warrant any credibility
The disconnect is between those that are inherently TDSers and will believe literally anything that makes him look bad and those that would like to find the so-called truth about if there was any coordinated effort involving Trump but realize this committee is not the vehicle to do that.
Trump had a rally. They went to Congress and some idiots used if for their own devices. Trump probably didn't mind after 2020, but I have not heard anything that shows he coordinated it over the 14 month investigation. I guarantee the DOJ used its "A" team on this.
From Peggy Noonan (quoting David French):
"First, Trump summoned the mob to Washington." Second, he "knew the mob was armed and dangerous." Third, he exhorted them to "fight like hell" and march on the Capitol. Ms. Hutchinson said he attempted to lead it himself. Fourth, he further inflamed the mob after the attack began by tweeting: "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what was necessary."
With this fact pattern, his earlier admonition to the crowd to move forward "peacefully and patriotically" looks, to Mr. French's eyes, "more like pro forma ass-covering than a genuine plea. It was a drop of pacifism in an ocean of incitement."
https://www.wsj.com/articles/courage-cassidy-hutchinson-testify-ketchup-wall-steering-wheel-meadows-jan-6-11656626001
It is all interpretation. It is a string of individual actions, edited to fit the narrative, that always ends with the same type of phrase: "to Mr. French's eyes" or "we can only assume" or "this indicates"... Get it??? That is the problem here. This is not a pattern of anything, it is a cherry picked list of innuendo, supposition and intransitive verbs. As is the whole waste of time. If there was something, he would have been charged a year ago.
I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Sam Lowry said:I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Kangaroo courts aren't big on rules. It's tough to hold a one sided show trial if there are rules.
It's not a trial.Golem said:Sam Lowry said:I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Kangaroo courts aren't big on rules. It's tough to hold a one sided show trial if there are rules.
Sam Lowry said:It's not a trial.Golem said:Sam Lowry said:I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Kangaroo courts aren't big on rules. It's tough to hold a one sided show trial if there are rules.
Yes it is. Only an abject liar would claim otherwise.
No, what I am seeing is predictable, biased and weak.Sam Lowry said:I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
It's not going to help your friends from hell, Sam. Or advance your own little vendetta.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
Than what is it? Even Grand Juries have rules. What do you call a completely 1-sided narrative, with no cross-examination, no standards of evidence, and there is no other acceptable outcome than Trump is guiltyt??Sam Lowry said:It's not a trial.Golem said:Sam Lowry said:I'm not "excusing" anything. There are reasons for the hearsay rules in court. Those reasons don't apply in this kind of proceeding. What you're seeing is legitimate evidence, like it or not.Oldbear83 said:That's just it. There really is no "evidence" worthy of the name.Sam Lowry said:I agree that much of it's been handled poorly. I mostly quit watching after the first hearing because the production was so bad. That's really beside the point, though. The evidence speaks for itself.Oldbear83 said:Sam Lowry said:But what you don't know is that you're throwing them a lifeline.Oldbear83 said:The 'grasping at straws' is all Democrat right now, and we all know it.Sam Lowry said:
Two hours of testimony followed by two days of manufactured hysteria over an issue that has yet to be raised on the record. This is the sound of panic, of a lost and leaderless rabble grasping at straws while the water closes over your heads.
Not in the least, Sam. Your obsession with fear of Trump blinds you to what's going on here.
Everything from the timing, to the committee staffing, to the media narrative, has been handled with Biden-like incompetence, and the Trump haters don't even see it because of their vicious delusion.
You have said yourself that this is not a court, in order to excuse the blatant hearsay and bias of the committee.
Kangaroo courts aren't big on rules. It's tough to hold a one sided show trial if there are rules.
Impeachments are more balanced than this and that is THE most political proceeding we have. Even Clinton was allowed to ask the the definition of the word "the"!
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
And again, no Congressional committee has law enforcement authority.Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
They are out of bounds and everyone knows it.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
An investigation on national TV??? Sort of like COPS, American Detectives or The Interrogator?Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
I got it, Injustice with Nancy Grace! That is it and Cheney plays Nancy Grace, same haircut and everything.
Not very credible, but a compelling watch. 4 Rotten Tomatoes...
No one claimed otherwise.Oldbear83 said:And again, no Congressional committee has law enforcement authority.Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
Hi, there…RMF5630 said:An investigation on national TV???Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
Helloooo...???
Yes Sam, we see you.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
Seems like you Forever Trumpers want a president who won't be indicted by a Congressional committee that is televised.RMF5630 said:An investigation on national TV??? Sort of like COPS, American Detectives or The Interrogator?Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
I got it, Injustice with Nancy Grace! That is it and Cheney plays Nancy Grace, same haircut and everything.
Not very credible, but a compelling watch. 4 Rotten Tomatoes...
Y'all don't want a committee to gather information because it reflects poorly on your boy and people can see it for what it is.
Sure, that's it.Osodecentx said:Seems like you Forever Trumpers want a president who won't be indicted by a Congressional committee that is televised.RMF5630 said:An investigation on national TV??? Sort of like COPS, American Detectives or The Interrogator?Guy Noir said:
It is an investigation not a trial. No charges have been submitted as of this time.
I got it, Injustice with Nancy Grace! That is it and Cheney plays Nancy Grace, same haircut and everything.
Not very credible, but a compelling watch. 4 Rotten Tomatoes...
Y'all don't want a committee to gather information because it reflects poorly on your boy and people can see it for what it is.
[ rolls eyes ]
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier