Afghanistan What a tragedy!

96,592 Views | 1370 Replies | Last: 2 days ago by RD2WINAGNBEAR86
Oldbear83
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It matters whether we excuse the monsters, or fight them.

I have no complaints about our actions up to 2003. After that, it was time plan the exit and what we would leave behind.

Kabul was never going to be the next Bonn or Tokyo, but it did not have to be f-ing Mogadishu, either.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
GoldMind
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Oldbear83 said:

It matters whether we excuse the monsters, or fight them.

I have no complaints about our actions up to 2003. After that, it was time plan the exit and what we would leave behind.

Kabul was never going to be the next Bonn or Tokyo, but it did not have to be f-ing Mogadishu, either.
Youd argue **** was wild honey, so, sure whatever.
Winning by cheating is just as impressive as winning fairly, probably even more so. Your opponent was better than you in every way, and you beat them with your brain.
Oldbear83
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GoldMind said:

Oldbear83 said:

It matters whether we excuse the monsters, or fight them.

I have no complaints about our actions up to 2003. After that, it was time plan the exit and what we would leave behind.

Kabul was never going to be the next Bonn or Tokyo, but it did not have to be f-ing Mogadishu, either.
Youd argue **** was wild honey, so, sure whatever.
You seem bitter, Goldmind. That's what, the tenth time this week?

You might want to give this board a rest, stick to baseball.

Just an idea.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
GoldMind
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Oldbear83 said:

GoldMind said:

Oldbear83 said:

It matters whether we excuse the monsters, or fight them.

I have no complaints about our actions up to 2003. After that, it was time plan the exit and what we would leave behind.

Kabul was never going to be the next Bonn or Tokyo, but it did not have to be f-ing Mogadishu, either.
Youd argue **** was wild honey, so, sure whatever.
You seem bitter, Goldmind. That's what, the tenth time this week?

You might want to give this board a rest, stick to baseball.

Just an idea.
You seem like someone with an IQ of about 70.

Cant just go around the globe fighting everyone we dont agree with.

Winning by cheating is just as impressive as winning fairly, probably even more so. Your opponent was better than you in every way, and you beat them with your brain.
Oldbear83
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GoldMind said:

Oldbear83 said:

GoldMind said:

Oldbear83 said:

It matters whether we excuse the monsters, or fight them.

I have no complaints about our actions up to 2003. After that, it was time plan the exit and what we would leave behind.

Kabul was never going to be the next Bonn or Tokyo, but it did not have to be f-ing Mogadishu, either.
Youd argue **** was wild honey, so, sure whatever.
You seem bitter, Goldmind. That's what, the tenth time this week?

You might want to give this board a rest, stick to baseball.

Just an idea.
You seem like someone with an IQ of about 70.

Cant just go around the globe fighting everyone we dont agree with.


Since I never said that, maybe I'm not the one with the IQ of 70.


You might want to stick to Sports, not world events.
That which does not kill me, will try again and get nastier
Jacques Strap
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ATL Bear
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Charlie Wilson's folly.
Jacques Strap
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Jacques Strap
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The Administration leaves Afghanistanand abandons America.

It would be easy to attribute the disaster of leaving Afghanistan, both human and strategic, to the incompetence of President Biden and his administration. After all, human incompetence normally explains a lot. But the affairs of a great nation like ours and its military are not the work of one man. There are generals, well-credentialed foreign policy experts, and senior intelligence officials who have devised how best to leave Afghanistan in order to achieve certain strategic and political objectives. The notion that there was a single incompetent decision made to abandon Afghanistan defies both logic and common sense. It was a matter of high government policy that the United States depart Afghanistan, abandon military equipment, and leave both Americans and our allies to the tender mercies of the radical Islamic Taliban.

The exit from Afghanistan, then, appears designed to accomplish two things: first, to demoralize the American military and the American people. Over 22,000 American service personnel have been killed or injured in Afghanistan. Every American knows someone who served there. Knowing full well that the Afghan military would not defend the country, there could be little doubt that the United States was turning the country over to the Taliban. Moreover, the US did so with the appearance of being run out of the country in shame and defeat. One can only assume this was meant to demonstrate to American servicemen that their sacrifice had been in vain, and to the American people that our cause of defending America from the scourge of radical Islam was not just.

How else are sensible people to view the footage of killings, chaos, desperation, harassment, and contempt for the US and our citizens in Kabul? Taken together these images are far more effective tools of propaganda than nearly anything Al-Qaeda and ISIS has employed over the past two decades. Their message is clear: America is weak and resistance to Islam is futile. That is the lesson the Biden Administration has made possible. It is one for which radicals such as Rashida Tlaib and Ilhan Omar have signaled their approval throughout their tenure in Congress.

The second purpose of the Afghan debacle was to signal to the world that the United States has no interest in defending a liberal world order and that from here on out we will not defend either human freedom or our own self-interest, however bizarre that may sound. Even the most serious isolationist would not have left Afghanistan the way we have. A minimum requirement would be to preserve the prestige and credibility of the United States with our allies and to ensure that our enemies would not be emboldened by our fecklessness.

What must Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea think of the United States and our commitments to defend them against the Communist Chinese and their predations in the region? To be sure, Afghanistan does not play a similar role to that of these other nations, whose economies are closely tied to the prosperity and the security of the United States. But for the US to withdraw in this dramatic fashion is to send a signal that we are no longer concerned whether our enemies fear us. They do not, apparently, and that is just fine.

There is a new world order and America has chosen a new place in it. Whereas we were comfortable "leading from behind" during the Obama administration, today the United States is merely one of many other nations doing our best to cooperate in what some have termed a Great Reset. Defending human freedom may have been fine for earlier generations, but what matters today is understanding the grievances and ambitions of other peoples, be it the Islamic world and their deeply held religious convictions or the Communist Chinese and their struggles to find their place atop the world order.

Self-Defeat
Political leanings aside, what of self-interest? There is no clearer evidence of this rejection than the abandonment of Bagram Air Base. Right now, if it were adequately fortified, the United States could have an expeditionary force poised to strike at anyone in the region who meant the US harm. Claremont Institute scholars Mark Helprin and Angelo Codevilla argued for something like this nearly two decades ago, as opposed to the nation-building efforts that proved so painfully misguided. Such a base of operations would not be part of some "forever war," but rather a forward outpost of US military power capable of defending the American homeland. No nation building, no lectures on LGBTQ rights, just straight national defense.

Leaving Bagram Air Base, and the billions in advanced equipment that was there, with the Afghan military will be seen rightly as an act of submission by the Biden Administration to a global order headed by Communist China. Certainly China, and apparently also Biden, would prefer an America in retreat and withdrawal from the world stage. What better way to demonstrate America's intentions to the PRC than withdrawing from the region and allowing our most advanced armaments to be taken by America's enemies?

More at the link
Jacques Strap
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Security Alert Embassy Kabul, Afghanistan

Event: Because of security threats outside the gates of Kabul airport, we are advising U.S. citizens to avoid traveling to the airport and to avoid airport gates at this time unless you receive individual instructions from a U.S. government representative to do so.

U.S. citizens who are at the Abbey Gate, East Gate, or North Gate now should leave immediately.
Actions to take:
  • Be aware of your surroundings at all times, especially in large crowds.
  • Follow the instructions of local authorities including movement restrictions related to curfews.
  • Have a contingency plan for emergencies and review the Traveler's Checklist.
  • Monitor local media for breaking events and adjust your plans based on new information.
  • Enroll in the Smart Traveler Enrollment Program(STEP) to receive Alerts and make it easier to locate you in an emergency.
  • Follow the Department of State on Facebook and Twitter.



HuMcK
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That's news to hear the Pentagon officially say that.
Doc Holliday
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HuMcK said:

That's news to hear the Pentagon officially say that.

The federal government has proven itself to be incompetent, inefficient, weak and corrupt.

I still don't understand why you would want to expand something that both parties abuse?
chriscbear
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Explosion near Kabul airport reported
Jacques Strap
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Large explosion heard at Kabul airport reports


Unconfirmed reports say a large explosion has been heard at Kabul's airport, after Western nations warned a terror attack there could be imminent.

The circumstances are unclear.

*THERE HAS BEEN A LARGE EXPLOSION AT KABUL AIRPORT: POLITICO

Bloomberg
*PENTAGON CONFIRMS EXPLOSION OUTSIDE KABUL AIRPORT






WacoKelly83
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chriscbear said:

Explosion near Kabul airport reported


More chaos brought to you by "The Buck Stops With Me" President. Don't worry though, we're gonna get every American out by August 31.
Doc Holliday
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Jacques Strap said:

Large explosion heard at Kabul airport reports


Unconfirmed reports say a large explosion has been heard at Kabul's airport, after Western nations warned a terror attack there could be imminent.

The circumstances are unclear.

*THERE HAS BEEN A LARGE EXPLOSION AT KABUL AIRPORT: POLITICO

Bloomberg
*PENTAGON CONFIRMS EXPLOSION OUTSIDE KABUL AIRPORT







Sad

Jacques Strap
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Jacques Strap
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Doc Holliday
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****

RD2WINAGNBEAR86
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We have been sold the the Taliban and Isis K are arch enemies. I call bull***** Biden and the highest levels of our military have been played.
"Never underestimate Joe's ability to **** things up!"

-- Barack Obama
Jacques Strap
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Hard to say what is going on and who is lying.
Could be a Taliban bomber posing as ISIS to scare the Afghans not yet evacuated to give up and leave the airport and ensure the US pulls out faster.
So many competing agendas and with three murderous terrorist groups on the ground (Taliban, Al Qaeda and ISIS) who knows who is doing what.

Giving up Bagram Air Base was a huge unforced error by Biden.

Jacques Strap
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SBIED = Suicide Bomber Improvised Explosive Device

Jacques Strap
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Agree.
The biggest mistake in this debacle is abandoning Bagram.



TexasScientist
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Jacques Strap said:

Agree.
The biggest mistake in this debacle is abandoning Bagram.




Yep. It will take time to repair the runways.
“It is impossible to get a man to understand something if his livelihood depends on him not understanding.” ~ Upton Sinclair
Jacques Strap
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Blaming the victims.



Jacques Strap
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Stranded Americans Dispute White House Claims of Smooth Afghanistan Evacuation

August 26, 2021 2:10 pm

Americans stranded in Afghanistan say they cannot reach the Kabul airport and that the Biden administration has been ineffective in quickly addressing emergency requests, according to Rep. Darrell Issa (R., Calif.), whose office has been scrambling in recent days to aid several California residents trapped in the country.

The families "are scared, stranded, and trapped in the Kabul area," Issa spokesman Jonathan Wilcox told the Washington Free Beacon on Thursday. "So far, they've been unable to reach the airport. I know [White House press secretary] Jen Psaki has previously said this isn't happening, but she's dead wrong."

Psaki on Tuesday said that any American who wants to leave Kabul can and that the effort cannot be called "anything but a success." The White House says all Americans will be flown out of the country by the Aug. 31 deadline to depart, but experts and others on the ground maintain this may not be possible. As the Taliban tightens its grip on Kabul, it has become increasingly dangerous, and in some cases impossible, for those stranded to travel to the city's airport.

Issa's team is attempting to work with the State Department, Department of Defense, and the White House to aid these Americans, who traveled to the country months before the Taliban took control. The State Department, which is supposed to be coordinating emergency evacuations, has been "way too slow and way too ineffective," according to Wilcox.

Information collected by Issa's staff from these Americans indicates that the Biden administration's claim that any U.S. citizen stuck in the country can come home is not true. Issa's office secured the evacuation of two families on Thursday afternoon, though others remain trapped.

The Taliban is preventing Americans and others from reaching the airport, which is the only location to board an emergency flight. The already chaotic situation became deadly on Thursday, when two explosions went off near the airport, reportedly killing 12 U.S. troops and wounding 15 others. The ISIS terror group, which has ramped up its presence in the country since the Taliban came to power, claimed responsibility for the airport attack.
Canon
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You voted for this. All because some mean tweets made your tummy hurt. Good work.
VN 68
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Some one needs to wake Joe up and fill him in on whats going on.
Wrecks Quan Dough
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VN 68 said:

Some one needs to wake Joe up and fill him in on whats going on.
The entire administration should resign.
GoldMind
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This isn't the first time people have died who didn't need to while Joe was calling shots. We knew this.
Winning by cheating is just as impressive as winning fairly, probably even more so. Your opponent was better than you in every way, and you beat them with your brain.
Jacques Strap
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...one woman from Uganda crawled through sewage pipes to get into the airport for the plane.

"We can't expect everyone to crawl through a sewer pipe to safety," said Mr. Abi-Habib. "The window is closing."

After being unsuccessful in getting more people onto the flights, a 345-seat plane left Kabul airport with only 50 passengers aboard, WSJ reported.

Jacques Strap
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I hope they boots on the ground are okay with this. If they were ordered by the knuckleheads in DC to destroy ammunition it would seem to make them more vulnerable to an attack.



Wrecks Quan Dough
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Probably recovered an improvised explosive device and detonated it.
STxBear81
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will be impossible now to evacuate every American. dont think the Biden Admin ever intended to get every one. just the most he could get. his management of this has been awful. he needs to be impeached immediately. worry about how awful kamala will be when she takes the position . if she sux too get rid of her.
whitetrash
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BornAgain said:

will be impossible now to evacuate every American. dont think the Biden Admin ever intended to get every one. just the most he could get. his management of this has been awful. he needs to be impeached immediately. worry about how awful kamala will be when she takes the position . if she sux too get rid of her.
That's how she got there in the first place.
 
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