Jacques Strap said:

---

2) Sadat's piece should be read and he should be taken seriously. He was holding out in Lashkar Gah when everyone said the Afghan Army wouldn't fight.

— Bill Roggio (@billroggio) August 25, 2021

4) To me, this stands out the most: "The Afghan forces were trained by the Americans using the U.S. military model based on highly technical special reconnaissance units, helicopters and airstrikes. We lost our superiority to the Taliban when our air support dried up ..."

— Bill Roggio (@billroggio) August 25, 2021

5) We built the wrong military in Afghanistan, one overly dependent on western models of fighting, high tech western gear, etc. Afghanistan needed a regionally based army army that could go toe to toe with the Taliban that wasn't reliant on tech.

— Bill Roggio (@billroggio) August 25, 2021

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GoldMind said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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Jacques Strap said:

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Harrison Bergeron said:

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This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

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It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

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Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

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jupiter said:

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I don't see how you could have gotten the weapons out,other than not giving to the Afghans in the first place. What was captured was basically what the Afghan Army was supposed to use to fight back with.

Either you try to take it away from them, leaving them toothless, or given how quickly they disintegrated/ switched sides it was already basically in the hands of the Taliban before their offensive even started and you would have had to fight to get them back at that point.

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

GoldMind said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

---

It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

---

Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

---

I do not disagree with you, but that is a separate question. I would easily argue having a presence in Afghanistan makes more sense than having a presence in Japan or Europe.

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

GoldMind said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

---

It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

---

Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

---

I do not disagree with you, but that is a separate question. I would easily argue having a presence in Afghanistan makes more sense than having a presence in Japan or Europe.

---

It's foolish not to have kept a pesence there, at least until, we could determine they were holding their own. Especially as tech dependent they were. Perhaps we should have focused on trainig them with lower tech capabilities for them also.

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

GoldMind said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

---

It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

---

Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

---

I do not disagree with you, but that is a separate question. I would easily argue having a presence in Afghanistan makes more sense than having a presence in Japan or Europe.

---

HuMcK said:

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

GoldMind said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

---

It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

---

Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

---

I do not disagree with you, but that is a separate question. I would easily argue having a presence in Afghanistan makes more sense than having a presence in Japan or Europe.

---

It's foolish not to have kept a pesence there, at least until, we could determine they were holding their own. Especially as tech dependent they were. Perhaps we should have focused on trainig them with lower tech capabilities for them also.

---

That day would not come, not even in another 10 years. The ANA suffered over 65k casualties (could be wrong but I think that number may only represent KIA, not missing or wounded) since 2018 with our air support and while the Taliban was also rooting out ISIS factions. Even without our air support, they still had their own airforce (half of it flew away to Uzbekistan), outnumbered the Taliban supposedly 2:1 on the ground, had equal or better equipment and a massive advantage in mechanized transport. Despite that, their generals decided it was best to stand aside, because at the end of the day the Taliban has the local support. I cannot stress enough that this latest Taliban summer offensive was coming no matter what, our air support may have delayed its ultimate success some, but this cake was baked in February 2020.

---

Quote:

---

Today with @RepMeijer I visited Kabul airport to conduct oversight on the evacuation.

Witnessing our young Marines and soldiers at the gates, navigating a confluence of humanity as raw and visceral as the world has ever seen, was indescribable.

It's a reminder of why America's valueswhen we live up to themmatter to people all over the world.
I've never talked to more public servants, from salty Marines to the most seasoned State Department officials, who came to tears describing their work.

The world has truly never seen anything like what America is doing in Kabul this weekdeeply tragic and highly heroic. Fear and desperation at their worst; hope and humanity at their finest.

We did this visit in secret to reduce risks and impact on the mission and we insisted on leaving in a plane that was not full, in a seat designated for crew so that we didn't take a seat from someone else.
Washington should be ashamed of the position we put our service members in, but they represent the best in America. These men and women have been run ragged and are still running strong. Their empathy and dedication to duty are truly inspiring.

The acts of heroism and selflessness we witnessed at HKIA make America proud.

We came into this visit wanting, like most veterans, to push the president to extend the August 31st deadline. After talking with commanders on the ground and seeing the situation here, it is obvious that because we started the evacuation so late, that no matter what we do.

we won't get everyone out on time, even by September 11. Sadly and frustratingly, getting our people out depends on maintaining the current, bizarre relationship with the Taliban.

In the coming days we'll have more to share with our colleagues & the American people about what we learned, but after meeting Marines, soldiers, & dedicated State Dept. officials on the groundwe want the world to know first & foremost we have never been prouder to be Americans.

---

fadskier said:

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Waco1947 said:

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Taliban is reasserting control. 20 years and 2,500 American deaths.

---

Thanks to Biden.

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US soldiers at Kabul airport now forcing German and international journalists onto a flight to Doha. https://t.co/SyiGBEf6sQ

— Tobias Schneider (@tobiaschneider) August 25, 2021

Jacques Strap said:

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US soldiers at Kabul airport now forcing German and international journalists onto a flight to Doha. https://t.co/SyiGBEf6sQ

— Tobias Schneider (@tobiaschneider) August 25, 2021

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Carlos Cruz said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

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US soldiers at Kabul airport now forcing German and international journalists onto a flight to Doha. https://t.co/SyiGBEf6sQ

— Tobias Schneider (@tobiaschneider) August 25, 2021

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It is about to get real over there if foreign media is being forced out.

---

Quote:

---

In the span of a week, the White House went from struggling to explain a rapidly deteriorating situation in Afghanistan to beating its chest.

Top Biden officials and administration allies have begun aggressively touting the success of their evacuation efforts in the war-torn country, offering frequent updates on the number of evacuees. They've framed the operation as historic in line with the Berlin airlift declared that they're "over performing" their own metrics, and trumpeted the president as "defying expectations."

---

TexasScientist said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

GoldMind said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Jacques Strap said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

This has got to be the biggest display of U.S. foreign policy incompetence in history. Granted, it may not be the largest in terms of total impact, but considering:
- Actual cost of forfeited military weapons and technology
- Long-term of giving that technology to our enemies including terrorists, the Taliban, China, Iran, and others
- Unnecessary human lives lost
- Strategic stupidity of giving up Bagram AFB given China's threats
- Worse of all just completely unnecessary - it is not like there was a Black Swan or anything that could not have been reasonably predicted

When you combine those factors and literally unbelievable incompetence, I cannot think of a worse blunder. Yes, something like Bay of Pigs was a cluster, but to not strategic cost to the U.S. Of course, our foreign engagements since WWII mostly have been dubious but they were generally some reasonable justification given contemporary thinking / reality (easy to look at Korea and Vietnam with current lens but can't totally fault Ike / JFK given 50s/60s cold war.

---

It may not be the worst but if Biden had withdrawn civilians then military in the winter during the "non-fighting season" it surely would have gone better.

---

Fair enough. Just seems like a totally avoidable. My kid could have provided a better plan:
1. Quietly get the weapons out even if it take a year
2. Quietly get all non-essential personnel out over a month or two
3. Use appropriate channels to ask other Americans if they want to leave
4. Beat the crap out of the Taliban so they will not feel like fighting for a bit
5. Then leave with a few arms, few people and as you said most obviously when the Taliban was not fighting

And still - keep Bagram. Why leave? We're still in myriad countries.

---

Because its a useless, massive drain on our economy to keep us in myriad countries.

---

I do not disagree with you, but that is a separate question. I would easily argue having a presence in Afghanistan makes more sense than having a presence in Japan or Europe.

---

It's foolish not to have kept a pesence there, at least until, we could determine they were holding their own. Especially as tech dependent they were. Perhaps we should have focused on trainig them with lower tech capabilities for them also.

---

RD2WINAGNBEAR86 said:

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Sec of State Blinken just told us in so many words that there are less than 1,000 Americans left in Afghanistan that want to leave. Hmmmmmmmmmm.

He also reminded us that the Taliban are in control.

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Everyone should take a moment to contemplate the fact that U.S. foreign policy is being whipped by barbarians, who will sell young and old women as sex slaves and return the culture to the 10th Century, and the U.S. president is hiding from the press during the crisis he singularly created.

---

‘Many of these men served us, today we’re slamming the gate on them and their families - it doesn’t feel great to be British on this side of the fence today’

Another powerful report from @johnirvineitv on the chaos in Kabul https://t.co/HHmolpI99T pic.twitter.com/RVKWnvimfY

— ITV News (@itvnews) August 22, 2021

Quote:

---

(CNN)Secretary of State Antony Blinken said Wednesday that there are approximately 1,500 people who may be Americans left in Afghanistan, adding that when evacuation operations began, there was a population of as many as 6,000 American citizens in the country who wanted to leave.

---

There is a "very high risk of a terrorist attack" against the evacuation operation by the UK, US and other allied forces in Kabul, according to a senior British source https://t.co/DKVy73IxLh

— Sky News (@SkyNews) August 25, 2021

NEW - 2 Afghans who worked at the 🇺🇸 @USEmbassyKabul and hold "Unescorted" Passes, were not evacuated from the Embassy Compound last week.

Both have been unable to reach Kabul Airport despite having the correct paperwork.

The @StateDept has offered them no assistance.

— Alex Tiffin (@RespectIsVital) August 25, 2021

🇺🇸 Secretary of State Anthony Blinken says Taliban will allow U.S. citizens and at risk Afghans to leave after August 31st.

Currently, at risk Afghans cannot reach the airport.https://t.co/MEWJjr0Q3t

— Alex Tiffin (@RespectIsVital) August 25, 2021

Jacques Strap said:

---

CNN Senate aide told CNN the State Department said that at least 4,100 American citizens are still actively seeking to get out of Afghanistan.

Senate aide told CNN the State Department said that at least 4,100 American citizens are still actively seeking to get out of Afghanistan. The source said not all the Americans are located in and around Kabul.

Earlier today, the Pentagon announced that a total of 19,000 evacuees left Afghanistan in the last 24 hours, with 42 US military aircraft carrying 11,200 people and another 7,800 people evacuated by coalition partners.

The Pentagon said there are more than 10,000 people waiting at the airport to leave but that the number would change as more people arrive at the airport and as flights depart.

---

Shakesbear said:

---

Harrison Bergeron said:

---

Everyone should take a moment to contemplate the fact that U.S. foreign policy is being whipped by barbarians, who will sell young and old women as sex slaves and return the culture to the 10th Century, and the U.S. president is hiding from the press during the crisis he singularly created.

---

To be sure, things are a cluster right now, but name me one country whose foreign policy was not whipped by the "Afghan barbarians"

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From the Think Defence Archive... How not to build an airforce, or what to do with 2Bn USD - https://t.co/cWGaw5mRqs pic.twitter.com/ArXGCFlSyN

— Think Defence (@thinkdefence) August 15, 2021