The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
Just, wow. Watching people and a country fall backward into the 11th century because of horrible actions by the US administration and THIS is where he wants to go? Bad taste just doesn't cover it.Jack Bauer said:
It took 12 people to write this "gem".The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
whiterock said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Someone should remind him that Biden reversed Trump on international agreements (Climate Accords, Iran Nuke Deal) on day one.
Yet, he let a much narrower agreement with the Taliban remain in place.
So it's just fatuous to suggest that Biden doesn't own this disaster. Biden could have scrapped Trump's deal and reversed it for the long haul at any time after he was inaugurated until yesterday.
HuMcK said:whiterock said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Someone should remind him that Biden reversed Trump on international agreements (Climate Accords, Iran Nuke Deal) on day one.
Yet, he let a much narrower agreement with the Taliban remain in place.
So it's just fatuous to suggest that Biden doesn't own this disaster. Biden could have scrapped Trump's deal and reversed it for the long haul at any time after he was inaugurated until yesterday.
You have an extremely limited understanding of how things work for a someone who claims to have worked in intel analysis. Those 5000 prisoners Trump let go probably constituted the bulk of the current Taliban officer corps. We already know their next President was released from jail in 2018, what a boon that must have been to get a chess piece of that stature back in exchange for nothing. There was no going back from an action like that, nor was it feasible to re-import all of the equipment and forces that left the country before Biden ever got in office.
So no, armchair general, he could not have simply reversed course on a dime to go back to status quo, and it is laughable that you think otherwise. If we had broken the deal, right after giving them back their most seasoned fighters and removing our forces, they would have started targeting US soldiers again and casualties would have spiked, then you would be here talking about how stupid that move was.
This is terrible here if true.Jacques Strap said:
Giving away Bagram AFB was a huge loss. Now we are stuck trying to secure a civilian airport for an airlift while surrounded by ever increasing numbers of Taliban..
US left Afghan airfield at night, didn't tell new commanderQuote:
BAGRAM, Afghanistan (AP) The U.S. left Afghanistan's Bagram Airfield after nearly 20 years by shutting off the electricity and slipping away in the night without notifying the base's new Afghan commander, who discovered the Americans' departure more than two hours after they left, Afghan military officials said.
He's a sorry sack of ****, what else would you expect.OsoCoreyell said:Just, wow. Watching people and a country fall backward into the 11th century because of horrible actions by the US administration and THIS is where he wants to go? Bad taste just doesn't cover it.Jack Bauer said:
It took 12 people to write this "gem".The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
Very Obama-like speech, #Biden sets up a complete straw-man argument that the choice was between a completely botched mishandled withdrawal and staying and fighting forever.
— Legal Insurrection (@LegInsurrection) August 16, 2021
I don't think most people are criticizing Biden for getting out of Afghanistan after 20yrs.. they are just criticizing HOW HE DID IT!
— Scottie Nell Hughes (@scottienhughes) August 16, 2021
Biden said he will not pass on the conflict to a fifth U.S. president and that the U.S. would no longer fight a war that is "not in our national security interest." https://t.co/GHoCq7bjve
— Axios (@axios) August 16, 2021
Simply not true. He's been in office since January and could have reversed any time. In fact, many of his own military advisors wanted him to do just that.HuMcK said:whiterock said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Someone should remind him that Biden reversed Trump on international agreements (Climate Accords, Iran Nuke Deal) on day one.
Yet, he let a much narrower agreement with the Taliban remain in place.
So it's just fatuous to suggest that Biden doesn't own this disaster. Biden could have scrapped Trump's deal and reversed it for the long haul at any time after he was inaugurated until yesterday.
You have an extremely limited understanding of how things work for a someone who claims to have worked in intel analysis. Those 5000 prisoners Trump let go probably constituted the bulk of the current Taliban officer corps. We already know their next President was released from jail in 2018, what a boon that must have been to get a chess piece of that stature back in exchange for nothing. There was no going back from an action like that, nor was it feasible to re-import all of the equipment and forces that left the country before Biden ever got in office.
So no, armchair general, he could not have simply reversed course on a dime to go back to status quo, and it is laughable that you think otherwise. If we had broken the deal, right after giving them back their most seasoned fighters and removing our forces, they would have started targeting US soldiers again and casualties would have spiked, then you would be here talking about how stupid that move was.
And Bergen was as fierce a Trump critic as anyone. There just is no defending Biden in this. Total disaster.Jacques Strap said:
CNN Opinion: The worst speech of Biden's presidencyQuote:
(CNN)On Thursday President Joe Biden spoke in defense of his ill-considered, hasty withdrawal from Afghanistan, in remarks peopled with straw men and littered with false assertions.
First, Biden contended that he was bound by a 2020 Trump administration agreement with the Taliban to withdraw all US troops by May 2021. But that was an agreement conducted by a previous administration -- so it's not binding -- and it was predicated on the Taliban breaking with al-Qaeda.
They didn't, according to the UN in a report released just last month.
It was also predicated on the Taliban engaging with the Afghan government in real peace negotiations. They haven't, according to Abdullah Abdullah, an Afghan official who leads the High Council for National Reconciliation. He told CNN a week ago that there has been "very little progress" in those negotiations.
GoldMind said:There was no plan. I dont think there ever was.Rawhide said:
biden will end up being worse than jimmy carter before too long.
When taliban takes over and provides a safe haven for terrorist groups to organize, radicalize and train to terrorize, when there is another terrorist attack on the USA, will humckleberry try to blame trump for biden's fubar'd handling of Afghanistan? Probably so.
Ghengis Khan was the last foreign invader to conquer the region in 1219....
My bad that was written July 10 (Updated 9:27 AM ET, Sat July 10, 2021) and I missed it.sombear said:And Bergen was as fierce a Trump critic as anyone. There just is no defending Biden in this. Total disaster.Jacques Strap said:
CNN Opinion: The worst speech of Biden's presidencyQuote:
(CNN)On Thursday President Joe Biden spoke in defense of his ill-considered, hasty withdrawal from Afghanistan, in remarks peopled with straw men and littered with false assertions.
First, Biden contended that he was bound by a 2020 Trump administration agreement with the Taliban to withdraw all US troops by May 2021. But that was an agreement conducted by a previous administration -- so it's not binding -- and it was predicated on the Taliban breaking with al-Qaeda.
They didn't, according to the UN in a report released just last month.
It was also predicated on the Taliban engaging with the Afghan government in real peace negotiations. They haven't, according to Abdullah Abdullah, an Afghan official who leads the High Council for National Reconciliation. He told CNN a week ago that there has been "very little progress" in those negotiations.
OsoCoreyell said:Just, wow. Watching people and a country fall backward into the 11th century because of horrible actions by the US administration and THIS is where he wants to go? Bad taste just doesn't cover it.Jack Bauer said:
It took 12 people to write this "gem".The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
What an unspeakably dumb argument, contradicted no less by the man you are trying to defend.HuMcK said:whiterock said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Someone should remind him that Biden reversed Trump on international agreements (Climate Accords, Iran Nuke Deal) on day one.
Yet, he let a much narrower agreement with the Taliban remain in place.
So it's just fatuous to suggest that Biden doesn't own this disaster. Biden could have scrapped Trump's deal and reversed it for the long haul at any time after he was inaugurated until yesterday.
You have an extremely limited understanding of how things work for a someone who claims to have worked in intel analysis. Those 5000 prisoners Trump let go probably constituted the bulk of the current Taliban officer corps. We already know their next President was released from jail in 2018, what a boon that must have been to get a chess piece of that stature back in exchange for nothing. There was no going back from an action like that, nor was it feasible to re-import all of the equipment and forces that left the country before Biden ever got in office.
So no, armchair general, he could not have simply reversed course on a dime to go back to status quo, and it is laughable that you think otherwise. If we had broken the deal, right after giving them back their most seasoned fighters and removing our forces, they would have started targeting US soldiers again and casualties would have spiked, then you would be here talking about how stupid that move was.
Jokes on them... it actually won't be taught by liberal teachers because it makes biden look bad.Jack Bauer said:
It took 12 people to write this "gem".The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
Lindsey Graham: Trump would not have withdrawn from Afghanistan if chaos was going to be the resulthttps://t.co/gatF1GjFMa
— Fox News (@FoxNews) August 16, 2021
“I started the process, all the troops are coming home, they (Biden) couldn’t stop the process. 21 years is enough. They (Biden) couldn’t stop the process, they (Biden) wanted to but couldn’t stop the process.”
— david nussbaum (@theNuzzy) August 15, 2021
- Trump, 1 month ago pic.twitter.com/9UPPbseyiI
If his speech was 5 minutes longer he would've gotten around to blaming Fox News, Ron DeSantis, Mickey Mouse and my mother-in-lawJack Bauer said:
Biden - "Trump, Trump, Trump."
No maks mandates on gov't planes? Hmmmm.......Forest Bueller_bf said:
This is how crowded that cargo plane filled to the brim was.
Wow.
Good bull**** is good bull**** - regardless of affiliation or party.Jack Bauer said:OsoCoreyell said:Just, wow. Watching people and a country fall backward into the 11th century because of horrible actions by the US administration and THIS is where he wants to go? Bad taste just doesn't cover it.Jack Bauer said:
It took 12 people to write this "gem".The situation in Afghanistan makes America look so bad, Texas has already banned schools from teaching it
— The Daily Show (@TheDailyShow) August 15, 2021
I think this is the kind of stuff that late-night writers are working on for tonight's "comedy" monologue.
whiterock said:What an unspeakably dumb argument, contradicted no less by the man you are trying to defend.HuMcK said:whiterock said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Someone should remind him that Biden reversed Trump on international agreements (Climate Accords, Iran Nuke Deal) on day one.
Yet, he let a much narrower agreement with the Taliban remain in place.
So it's just fatuous to suggest that Biden doesn't own this disaster. Biden could have scrapped Trump's deal and reversed it for the long haul at any time after he was inaugurated until yesterday.
You have an extremely limited understanding of how things work for a someone who claims to have worked in intel analysis. Those 5000 prisoners Trump let go probably constituted the bulk of the current Taliban officer corps. We already know their next President was released from jail in 2018, what a boon that must have been to get a chess piece of that stature back in exchange for nothing. There was no going back from an action like that, nor was it feasible to re-import all of the equipment and forces that left the country before Biden ever got in office.
So no, armchair general, he could not have simply reversed course on a dime to go back to status quo, and it is laughable that you think otherwise. If we had broken the deal, right after giving them back their most seasoned fighters and removing our forces, they would have started targeting US soldiers again and casualties would have spiked, then you would be here talking about how stupid that move was.
Biden could have, had he determined it necessary, surged 40k troops into the country and re-established the 20-year stalemate we maintained in the mountains.
Bush did that.
Biden did not do that.
He could have done another shock & awe campaign at any time.
He did not do that.
He could have prepared an orderly withdrawal, covered by shock & awe, that destroyed equipment rather than leaving full depots.
He did not do that.
He could have had assets in place to remove diplomats and citizens well in advance.
He did not do that.
A smart POTUS would have done at least a little of all that, in advance of departure.
He did not do that.
I mean, did he have the embassy on drawdown? They advertised for a FSN position THIS WEEK, so the answer is no. Key question: were there dependents at post? I don't know, but the answer will be telling.
Instead, just days ago, he stood in front of a microphone, as did his SecState separately back in July, and flatly refuted your assertions. He insisted that the Afghan Army would NOT collapse, that there would be no disorderly retreat. (so much for your assertions about Trump sealing our fate a year ago.) No serious observer of Afghan affairs ever thought Afghan Army could ever win a war against the Taliban. But it seems like Sleepy Joe the Foreign Policy Expert relied on exactly that calculation....that the Afghans could cover our retreat.
Seriously, Huck. The premise that this is Trump's fault is childishly silly. I'm certainly not suggesting vanquishing the Taliban was ever in the cards for anyone. My critique is about a botched retreat. And "botched" does not fully capture the essence of what happened.
In fairness to Biden and his predecessor, it was Obama who is most responsible. He could have pulled out of Afghanistan the day after we killed Bin Ladin, when the Taliban was not nearly as strong as it is today. Sure, over time, the same thing would have happened. But we would not be scrambling airlift assets which will not fully be on site for another 48 hours. By staying to craft the Afghani future, we mission-creeped ourselves from doing something only the USA could have done (find/kill BinLadin) to doing something our nation simply does not have the political will to do anymore - nationbuild.
And it's also not fair to really even solely blame Biden. The man is in an advanced stage of senescence. It's the Democrat foreign policy establishment, full of progressives these days, who are running the show. This is on them. They stood down the military to indoctrinate them in Critical Race Theory to prepare for what their worldview told them was the most imminent threat = white supremacy. Well, we're prepared for that paper tiger. It's the real tiger that got our ass. And until you knuckleheads wake up and joint the real world, you are going to keep making messes and getting people killed.
Is biden responsible for any of this or is it all trumps fault?HuMcK said:
What I'm trying to tell is that reversal equals escalation. We gave them back some of their best fighters and reduced our own strength, that happened in the last administration, if we reneged on the deal they agreed to it would not be a simple return to status quo, it would be renewed fighting against a suddenly better matched opponent.
This isn't trump's fault. This 100% on biden. Unless biden called trump and trump told him exactly what to do, trump's fingerprints aren't on biden's fubar'd pull out.HuMcK said:
You've already responded to my comments saying they both share some blame, and some of the key decisions that set the stage for this took place in 2020. No matter how much you want it to not be true, what I'm saying is what happened.
I've detailed mistakes both Biden and Trump made, it's your turn to acknowledge that Trump had a hand in this too.
HuMcK said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Again, dispute what I wrote or stfu. Support your conclusions with reasoning, if you are even capable.
sorry, drop tanks not drop tanksQuote:
A forward arming and refuelling point (FARP) or forward area refuelling point is a NATO term for an area where aircraft (typically helicopters) can be refuelled and re-armed at a distance closer to their area of operations than their main operating base.
we cant, that is against the international statute for secrecy.. better hide from the obliviation squad!Canon said:HuMcK said:Canon said:HuMcK said:
That's extra rich coming from him. Taliban was already violating the terms of their "deal" with offensives before Trunp left office. They wanted us gone months ago, Trump literally criticized Biden for pushing the date from May to September, if anything the withdrawal would have been more chaotic and unorganized back then if that's possible. Extra irony is someone that admin had released from prison in 2018 is the presumptive next Taloban leader of Afghanistan.
It's not an accident that the deal they struck scheduled the handover during the next admin's term, they knew how this was always going to end no matter who was in office, especially after the large prisoner release.
Your relationship with reality is so tenuous, you might as well be posting about Hogwarts.
Again, dispute what I wrote or stfu. Support your conclusions with reasoning, if you are even capable.
You made claims with no evidence. Link to legit sites that confirm your assertions. No one with adult obligations is going to debate your wild ramblings without your providing evidence.
Once you do that, we can then address your absurd conspiracy theories. When we are finished there, we can talk of muggles and unforgivable curses.
Rawhide said:This isn't trump's fault. This 100% on biden. Unless biden called trump and trump told him exactly what to do, trump's fingerprints aren't on biden's fubar'd pull out.HuMcK said:
You've already responded to my comments saying they both share some blame, and some of the key decisions that set the stage for this took place in 2020. No matter how much you want it to not be true, what I'm saying is what happened.
I've detailed mistakes both Biden and Trump made, it's your turn to acknowledge that Trump had a hand in this too.
I know you so desperately want it to not be biden's fault.....but no luck scooter. It falls squarely on his shoulders.
Ousted Afghan President Fled Country With Cars, Helicopter "Stuffed Full Of Cash" https://t.co/NECsCD3Eiy
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) August 16, 2021
Satellite images taken on Monday showed large crowds of Afghans breaking out of terminals at Kabul airport and racing across the tarmac. Photos showed some civilians climbing onto the top of a jet. https://t.co/6QJvtuLunu
— The New York Times (@nytimes) August 16, 2021
